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Going to make this short, as it is a continuation off of https://feral-heart.com/smf/index.php?topic=65566.0.
It has been years since the removal of General chat back in 2013. it was removed without any prior warning to the community, and the reasons being were a little murky and unclear. Since the community has definitely matured and the staff team has become more efficient, are you for or against the revival of general chat? Do you feel it would benefit the game or only cause more issues in regards to both the present and the future? Anyone is free to elaborate and give their ideas and suggestions regarding general.
As community members we have the right to voice our opinions and discuss them in a civil manner. Regardless of it being an urgent issue or not, we help to represent the community wishes and questions. If any responses are overly-aggressive towards other players and/or staff I will have this immediately locked, and it would only be setting an example to not be listened to. I know this topic is repetitive but a large portion of the community wants to talk about it still, so why not let them? Any clarification and explanation in regards to why it will not/will be returning would be greatly appreciated. I am also fine with this being locked as long as it is given proper explanation.
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While I am curious to see how it would be, maybe it wouldn't be a good idea to bring it back. At least for now. There really aren't too many players online anymore, and the majority of them stay right in one spot in The Grounds, where everyone can hear each other anyway without the help of general.
Just my two cents.
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While I am curious to see how it would be, maybe it wouldn't be a good idea to bring it back. At least for now. There really aren't too many players online anymore, and the majority of them stay right in one spot in The Grounds, where everyone can hear each other anyway without the help of general.
Just my two cents.
The reason why everyone is so close all the time is most likely due to not having any other way to communicate if we’re spread out across the map. Having a party chat as a replacement for general is also very inconvenient. People would spread out more if they knew that they could talk to everyone from other parts of the map.
What about other, bigger maps? Cherika, Kibou and Eastern Pass are very active on the weekends. It would be nice if you could talk to people from the whole other side of the map, while exploring the other part.
“It wouldn’t be a good idea to bring it back. At least for now.” - We’ve been here, without general for years. How long do we have to wait for? I think it’s been long enough. Having general removed doesn't bring any good to the community.
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In all honesty, I am very Neutral about this topic.
The topic about bringing General Chat up is not a new one in this community, as it's been several years since Feral-Heart has been up.
Why I'm All for it -- While I might be all for bringing back General Chat, there are some cons that I'll list down below later in this. General allows for the player to communicate with other players across-map. It's similar to how online multiplayer games can spy on other's conversations while you're on your own, busying away with other tasks, but can also contribute to the conversation here and there. Impressive Title Servers advocate for the general chat due to speech bubbles that are definitely a big flaw to said "local" chat, whereas Feral-Heart does not have that issue, so Local has been big on how community members interact with one another. Although I joined a little later than the existence of the General-Chat, I've heard lots about how a variety of old players would definitely enjoy to see it's return. If a large amount of players would like to seen it's return, then It, perhaps, wouldn't hurt to see what it would be like. Feral-Heart has grown since it's previous years.
After the incident back late last year, Feral-Heart's player count has more than likely, decreased; therefore you wouldn't see as many online as you used to, and this would even apply to years prior to 2018. FH's lessening population would encourage General's return !
However, I believe that Feral-Heart can still be, and has been, thriving without it.
Here's why I don't find it necessary - General Chat, If I remember correctly, or read it somewhere, was removed due to the high population count. If you already knew, people talk a whole lot in Local Chat already. Now, imagine the amount of spam and flooding that General-Chat would receive if members over a whole map could communicate all at once. It would also be an unfortunate hassle for Razmirz to remove it, and now add it back in, and if he felt like it didn't have a purpose to hold, take it back out. Many people tend to group up in The-Grounds, mainly around the portal area to check out what's going on in Local chat, or even be around friends, but most times than not, people wouldn't contribute to what's going on. There is also this slight boundary where younger-aged members will confuse Local and General-Chat. Local, you often see the... interesting role-plays that go on there. As for Party Chat, I don't find it quite of a nuisance, as-in, Party Chat has been a type of private chat between a group of members online, or a separate role-play chat for frequent role-players.
Feral-Heart can still survive with or without the well-favored General in my opinion !
Although I'd love to hear more opinions, nonetheless.
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i'm gonna not format this for the sake of time
so for those of you that didn't read this thread - what r u doin gO THERE NOW (https://feral-heart.com/smf/index.php?topic=65566.0)
it basically explains absolutely all of the issues that FH has had with General in the past and why they're irrelevant
it's also why this thread exists[ily alpha]
now
gonna quickly go through some points
jesus bless me
@Azura
that's the entire problem.
no one is branching out and seeing what there is to see in the game because the people simply aren't there.
you'd all have to explore in exactly the same spot.
back in the old days of FH, the reason it did so well after General was removed[and i don't mean better than before - because that's debatable] was because people already had established spots to go around
there were also more people who were just willing to not be in the more populated areas
they made their own places
this is an MMO. you play an MMO to socialize/talk to/see other people. this is like if suddenly no one went out into the wilderness and stayed in the grand exchange on runescape.
that makes 0 sense and you miss out on a large chunk of the game and what it has to offer.
valar brought up another good point if you're skipping posts go look at hers nerd
@TToskuu[love the name btw i cant pronounce it but it's cool]
general wasn't removed because too many people used it. it was removed because of spam and people not knowing about turning it off.
if people confuse local and general... they'll confuse local and general.
there is nothing to stop them from asking for clarification, or being gently informed. that's what we're here to do at FH - be gentle with corrections, no?
party chat really has nothing to do with this as it's obviously a temporary private chat. i don't really understand why you brought it up. it has nothing to do with general chat.
i don't want to sound mean, but i do not understand.
feralheart i'd say hasn't really been thriving - it's moreso the remnant of what is left of this community is stuck in for the long run.
general would just improve quality of life on the game.
now time for me to post what me think because me big brain
raz locking the thread with a vague statement isn't really shocking to me. i can only ask what i might have done wrong on the thread or if something was miscarried in the process.
i do not expect an answer, as i understand Raz prioritizes his real life over FH and was probably tired of people sending it over to him over and over.
however.
just because you prioritize the IRL over a digital space, doesn't mean you should just... not explain what it is you are doing.
especially in a community that has had tense relations towards staff and raz himself, or vice versa.
the entire general chat saga is reflective of that.
i do hope that the decision can still be made on general chat, and that maybe the thread is either unlocked or given proper explanation as to why it was dabbed on.
i don't want a repeat of yeet skeet mcgeet.
that was something i actually put time into and made triple sure no one could go 'you didnt provide a solution'.
but now we're here.
i again apologize if some of this is hard to read i'm multi-tasking like mad.
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I really have no room to speak in all of this, but I think I should as there's been a bit of an issue with this same topic coming up again and again.
Firstly, I think it should be addressed, something I want to state adamantly about because it kind of upsets me now that I'm looking at things. The previous thread that was made in regards to this, there was a lot of discussion, even with staff members, who kind of beat around the bush about the topic but were very outspoken about the idea of General chat coming back. This, I think, was a mistake.
Why?
It was bound to give hope to something that is likely not going to happen. As much as that disappoints me, there should have been a decision made from the get-go before anything should've been said in the discussion itself. As you can see now, there is still no rightful decision, and basically the idea has been strung along and people have been led to believe something that simply won't be existent, at least not for a very long time.
Should there have been more of an elaborate reason as to why this discussion should cease? Possibly, but it also should not be dragged on for as long as it has been. I believe that with so many people who have brought up this discussion on General chat, it should be acknowledged that we won't have a straightforward answer, or maybe our answer has been given. We should acknowledge that as many times this is brought up, we aren't going to get an answer, or perhaps with how many times threads have been locked for this discussion, we should likely take the hint and back away from it for a bit and allow the Staff to make that decision, and return to us when they feel they've made a decision on it.
The more we bring this up, the more annoying it gets, and the more nothing is done about it. I think we should leave this be for now, and allow them to come to us when they feel it is right.
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I really have no room to speak in all of this, but I think I should as there's been a bit of an issue with this same topic coming up again and again.
Firstly, I think it should be addressed, something I want to state adamantly about because it kind of upsets me now that I'm looking at things. The previous thread that was made in regards to this, there was a lot of discussion, even with staff members, who kind of beat around the bush about the topic but were very outspoken about the idea of General chat coming back. This, I think, was a mistake.
Why?
It was bound to give hope to something that is likely not going to happen. As much as that disappoints me, there should have been a decision made from the get-go before anything should've been said in the discussion itself. As you can see now, there is still no rightful decision, and basically the idea has been strung along and people have been led to believe something that simply won't be existent, at least not for a very long time.
Should there have been more of an elaborate reason as to why this discussion should cease? Possibly, but it also should not be dragged on for as long as it has been. I believe that with so many people who have brought up this discussion on General chat, it should be acknowledged that we won't have a straightforward answer, or maybe our answer has been given. We should acknowledge that as many times this is brought up, we aren't going to get an answer, or perhaps with how many times threads have been locked for this discussion, we should likely take the hint and back away from it for a bit and allow the Staff to make that decision, and return to us when they feel they've made a decision on it.
The more we bring this up, the more annoying it gets, and the more nothing is done about it. I think we should leave this be for now, and allow them to come to us when they feel it is right.
I do agree with Calvary's statement here. I am going to keep this rather short because pushing and pulling at the topic will not accomplish anything.
We may never get an answer, and on the contrary, we may someday. No one knows. But every attempt to speak about the chat being removed has ended in failure. Is there a connection there? Probably. It would be nice to get a solid answer and reason someday as to why they will not bring it back, for the sake of the community. I do agree with that completely. I don't think leaving the community out in the dark is fair in any way, for any reason. Especially with how the chat was removed initially without any of the community knowing or even having a say in it.
The staff team makes decisions they think is the best which in all realty, will not please everybody every single time. In my honest opinion and I think the best we can all do is take a step back from this subject until further notice or reasoning if there happens to be one in the future. <3
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It's rather blinding to the community when we are restrained on giving an opinion about this topic, simply because someone doesn't want us to keep suggesting it even though it's a popular interest for the game's survival.
So far, there is no real reason why the chat won’t return, regardless of whether the staff team is active and can easily control the chat.
If the topics were not getting locked without explanation (except "actions speak volumes" which is in itself egocentric, because our actions, constant talk about general chat also speaks for itself), there wouldn’t be reasons to make any more posts.
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It's rather blinding to the community when we are restrained on giving an opinion about this topic, simply because someone doesn't want us to keep suggesting it even though it's a popular interest for the game's survival.
So far, there is no real reason why the chat won’t return, regardless of whether the staff team is active and can easily control the chat.
If the topics were not getting locked without explanation (except "actions speak volumes" which is in itself egocentric, because our actions, constant talk about general chat also speaks for itself), there wouldn’t be reasons to make any more posts.
I must say that this post displays exactly the same sentiments that I was thinking.
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I made this thread after being prompted to by several people to do so. I do agree it is annoying, and I myself know it will not accomplish much. I understand the reasoning behind while it will not likely return, but a large portion of the community does not, especially when some staff are so persistent on why it should be revived. It is confusing to the regular user. I am not pushing an agenda for General, it's just that the community was simply turned away in an inappropriate fashion. Whether it is the best decision or not is irrelevant to me at this point.
Just having this thread open, regardless if it receives any replies or not, speaks leagues about the administration. It shows they accept discussion and encourage it, even if we are all essentially kicking a dead horse. General is as dead as contacting Kovu at this point, yet discussing ideas is still widely encouraged, as it shows there is still life and an urge to better Feralheart. It is the whole reason this board essentially has existed since the game was made public. Not all proposals will be implemented but it doesn't make them any less worthy of discussion. Furthermore, the locking and little explanation of the former thread does nothing but embarrass those involved—it embarrasses the administration itself, and doesn't translate well to the community or those that are unfamiliar with General.
This thread is not retaliation by any means, it is simply a push to encourage more transparency, even if it's not the most popular method of doing so.
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While I am curious to see how it would be, maybe it wouldn't be a good idea to bring it back. At least for now. There really aren't too many players online anymore, and the majority of them stay right in one spot in The Grounds, where everyone can hear each other anyway without the help of general.
Just my two cents.
This is exactly what we are trying to solve though. It's a problem that needs fixing.
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I made this thread after being prompted to by several people to do so. I do agree it is annoying, and I myself know it will not accomplish much. I understand the reasoning behind while it will not likely return, but a large portion of the community does not, especially when some staff are so persistent on why it should be revived. It is confusing to the regular user. I am not pushing an agenda for General, it's just that the community was simply turned away in an inappropriate fashion. Whether it is the best decision or not is irrelevant to me at this point.
Just having this thread open, regardless if it receives any replies or not, speaks leagues about the administration. It shows they accept discussion and encourage it, even if we are all essentially kicking a dead horse. General is as dead as contacting Kovu at this point, yet discussing ideas is still widely encouraged, as it shows there is still life and an urge to better Feralheart. It is the whole reason this board essentially has existed since the game was made public. Not all proposals will be implemented but it doesn't make them any less worthy of discussion. Furthermore, the locking and little explanation of the former thread does nothing but embarrass those involved—it embarrasses the administration itself, and doesn't translate well to the community or those that are unfamiliar with General.
This thread is not retaliation by any means, it is simply a push to encourage more transparency, even if it's not the most popular method of doing so.
I agree 100% with this. Mainly because the topic itself isn't necessarily annoying, but I can see how over the course of time it can get difficult to keep up with alongside other things.
I think the main part of this is, is that despite it being brought up; it probably isn't a large priority at the moment and would take a while before it's even put back in, or maybe even not. General is quite dead, and in my personal opinion it could benefit the game, but it honestly wouldn't help it stay afloat. It's for nostalgia, if we are being honest. The main purpose is to talk across the map, and to bring it back would be a big kick for old players, but it isn't enough to keep the game itself surviving. New ideas, much like the ones that have been brought up, are something we can all put in that isn't kicking a dead horse. Perhaps the locking of the thread, despite it not being very handy, was probably a way of saying, "I think that's enough."
I think we also have to understand that as many ideas as we put out, we have to be aware that there are many staff, all with differing opinions. The more staff, the more input you have to wait for, and it could take decades to input anything if the discussion simply isn't a priority. Repeating threads could go well as a reminder, but may get a bit frustrating over time. There is also, by what I can see, a large dispute between whether or not General should return or not, leaving the discussion practically barren.
What would be an excellent idea, is if Staff had a poll bi-monthly for all community members to interact with and state what they'd like to see both forum wise and game wise. (Perhaps a poll with different and well-liked ideas brought up from this board), and the community can vote on what one thing they'd like to see worked on as a priority. It may give staff a better idea on what they'd like to see implemented first. Just a thought, though!
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Since I didn't post what I had written out on Jango's now locked topic before it was locked, I guess I'll say it now.
Personally speaking here, General has been something that we've all fought on for so many years. Bring it back. Don't bring it back. Bring it back but change it. Bring it back but it better not be brought back changed, or else we don't want it. I for one, hope this issue resolves soon because I'm getting a little tired of an old decision being brought up time and time again, with no real, set in stone reason as to why it should be brought back, or why it should stay removed from the game. As for simply discussing it, I have no issues, however we are essentially just repeating ourselves again and again. So when does it end? If you look at it, we've constantly, relentlessly brought it up throughout the years, and every single time resulting in failure. Let me note, that the definition of insanity is repeating the same thing over time and time again and expecting a different result.
If we use the argument of "the community has grown and matured," you're cutting out all of the younger kids still playing who can easily abuse the chat. They easily get excited and don't really think before doing, so mistakes and various hyper actions are to be expected from those young ones. For us "older and more mature players," one would hope that they use it reasonably. We still have some of those players who are older but are still growing and are immature to an extent. "But we have more staff to help monitor the chat!" This being true, seeing how much local blows up at times, just imagine having to monitor BOTH chats blowing up. It most definitely would not be a pleasant thing to get on every single day and do, and for how many maps? The Grounds, Eastern Pass, Kiwimbi Beach, Bonfire, Zama, Cape, Seaside, Ficho, Cherika, Kibou. 10 maps that the staff would have to monitor. Granted we have enough to be sent to every single map, think about what else they have to do every day. Monitor the site, keep the site clean and organized, help players with their issues, discuss multiple things and plan events, monitor those events, and overall make sure everything is in line. You can argue that not all the maps are active like they are The Grounds and are least likely to blow up, but that just leaves all of the less active maps as a big target for General Chat mischief, whatever it may be. That's just one of the various issues and ways it could be seen.
Back when I joined, there was no General Chat. I knew it existed in the chat options, but of course I could never use it in public maps. For four years, I got along just fine without using it. Personally, I never really used it in external maps with the exception of others speaking to me through it rarely, and map rules from their creators upon entering when the group was there. Basically speaking, the game would be no different upon bringing it back aside from being able to speak with everyone within the same map as you regardless of distance between you and the other without having to hassle with a few clicks to make a party with them. Whilst in party, you can speak to anyone in any map just so long as you're in the same party.
Now, being more blunt here, I personally say make a decision and drop this topic. It has been run into the ground how many times over how many years. It's getting old. If we bring back General, then how long will it take for the old function to loose it's charm? I think we should leave the gem we call General alone. If we bring general back, it wouldn't really be the same, just like the old maps. It would be great and all for General to be back and all it's glory, but how much of it's glory is really still there? The only solution I could ever say to this is bring it back for a month, see how it rides, and make a final decision. Out, or in. Or just drop it entirely right now and stop this back and forth "bring it back - let it go." With these kinds of things that have gone on for so long, it's really best to just make a decision and go with it.
I said it once, and I'll say it again. The definition of insanity is repeating the same thing over time and time again and expecting a different result.
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right i'm just gonna make something short and sweet
let's look at this objectively
forget the general chat of old
forget the drama surrounding it's removal
forget all of that
at it's core, general chat is a global chat function that literally every other MMO has.
there will be spam, sure. it can be abused, and it will be.
but that's part and parcel with the benefit of having a global chat.
region chat in warframe as an example -
it's very hard to socialize with people outside of the 1 trading center and maybe sometimes you'll be grouped up with people willing to talk in a mission.
if it didn't have a global chat function, people would have to crowd around maroo's bazaar and relays in order to even start up a conversation.
but with region chat, it doesn't matter where you are in the game. you could be in a mission, be on your ship, running around playing with chickens in cetus
you have the option of talking to other people regardless of your location.
sure, you can still group up and talk to people in relays or in the back-alleys of fortuna. but it's been streamlined to help encourage people to be social - that's what playing an MMO is all about.
playing with other people.
talking to said people.
making friends.
having fun with friends.
grofit.
of course, warframe has it's own moderation team to help keep the region chat a safe place to be. feralheart is no different.
i think they also have about the same amount of people[ish], and they're able to do the job well even with their own hectic schedules.
no matter what you call it
region chat
global chat
general chat
server chat
they all have the same function and purpose
allow people to talk to one another over long distances in the game, without having to bend over backwards to get to where the people are.
apart from adding an additional job to the life of a FeralHeart staff member, there are no drawbacks.
but just like in warframe, if you don't want to see region chat - you can turn it off and click away.
this is why i want general chat back.
not because of memories i might've had back in the day, or because i think the game will die without it.
it's because it has a simple, practical function that i'd like to see implemented again.
and for a few other reasons. (https://feral-heart.com/smf/index.php?topic=65566.0)
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one google search away...
Insanity:
1. The state of being seriously mentally ill; madness.
2. extreme foolishness or irrationality.
So many get this wrong. =/
I do not believe it is insane to talk about things you'd like or not like in a civilised manner, no matter how often it is said. (Provided it is not in the form of spam of course.)
Back to the topic though.
I've only been back for a few days and have noticed a bit of unrest about the General Chat feature's removal from long ago. I think that if the one who makes the final decision ultimately decides it should be kept 'as is' then fine, I respect that. I personally would prefer it to return in some way, even if only used as an advertising channel, as mentioned before. However, I also feel as though we will be able to get by without the feature, as we have in recent years.
The Party Chat stuff? That made me think of a dedicated party chat character just sitting around somewhere. Not sure that it is any good but I wanted to share the idea. xD
It works at a global scale to. o.o
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@Ame
There is a great difference between madness and perseverance. Desire to seek an answer.
"When does it end?" It most likely ends when we get answers to questions we have put up for years. Why isn’t the chat back in the game? What else is the reason of removing it, apart from the fear of spam. Yes, there are children who will spam the chat, but there are also people and children who will report to the administrators.
"Having to monitor BOTH chats blowing up ... -... Granted we have enough to be sent to every single map, ..." Not really, there are only a few people in these maps, most of which are a part of their own role plays and don’t necessarily speak in other chats besides group or party. The local chat gets very active only in the later hours. And most of all over the weekend. Staff do not have to check every single map constantly. If it had to be constantly, every single day, then it would have also been when only the Local Chat was active.
"Back when I joined, there was no general chat" Well you see, there are some, let's say little inconveniences when people who comment this on the matter of general chat. They never had it (except in private maps). They didn’t experience talking to random people across the other side of the map to such extent as some of us have. Therefore being one of the reasons why we seek answers so much. I'm not telling you that you have no right to state your opinion, because of course everyone has all right to do it, I'm saying that it's not entirely right when someone who didn’t use it says that the chat doesn’t have to be brought back because we as a community “don’t even need it”.
"But how much glory is still there?" Quite a lot actually. Much more than you can imagine. General was the everyday life of our Feral Heart game play. It binds us in some way. Same as in servers in many other games, there is always a chat in which you can talk to all the people on the same server. I repeat, calling other people insane is very inexcusable.
Party chat isn't and it never or should for that matter, be a replacement for General chat.
I wholeheartedly agree with Jango's comment.
Also agreeing to Vortex's comment about insanity ^ which should be dropped, as it's not even a subject we're speaking about, or should be spoken about in this thread (or any thread) as it is a very serious topic.
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I'm not going to type a few paragraphs here explaining why general chat should return. In fact, I believe the game needs it to return. I've wanted it back for a long time now. I've come here to clarify a common misconception instead...
The majority of staff have at one point or another expressed wanting general's return; so why hasn't it? Raz does not find our (or anyone's) concerns/arguments valid. I ask that you turn to him, and not us, because for a long time now the staff haven't been the ones against it
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one google search away...
Insanity:
1. The state of being seriously mentally ill; madness.
2. extreme foolishness or irrationality.
So many get this wrong. =/
I'm not speaking about someone who has a mental illness. There are various definitions of insanity, and the one you're using is far different than the one I've mentioned to describe what is currently being done with General.
There is a great difference between madness and perseverance. Desire to seek an answer. - I repeat, calling other people insane is very inexcusable. - Also agreeing to Vortex's comment about insanity ^ which should be dropped, as it's not even a subject we're speaking about, or should be spoken about in this thread (or any thread) as it is a very serious topic.
Party chat isn't and it never or should for that matter, be a replacement for General chat. -
As I've said, yes, there is a fine deference. I'm not calling anyone insane. I'm saying we are repeating the same things we've been speaking about for years. We've brought up the same reasons after another to bring it back and yet it hasn't been done due the cooperation of I'm going to assume one ceases to budge. I'm not bringing up a serious problem that others have in this world. What I've said in the manner that it was said, was of an old tongue. I'm saying what we're doing is rather repetitive and, like Alpha has said, beating a dead horse. Perhaps I should've been more clear. I ask that you don't attack me and twist my words for giving a mere example.
I'm not saying party should or is a replacement for General. I was making an observation and comparing the two, as I know they are not the same nor ever will be.
To clarify, I'm not against bringing it back just because "I didn't have it." I've been through various other MMOs and seen various other General chats. I'm up for whatever decision is made. For the comment about other maps having issues, I'm simply just saying, it's an older function within the game that was removed for reasons, and that there could be issues like that, not that there will be. Once again, I was just giving an example.
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I apologize if I seemed aggressive, I understand where you're coming from. It can indeed feel repetitive at times, such is the nature of long-standing discussions. =)
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The post before didn’t seem like it, but okay. Though I wasn’t attacking anyone or twisting anyone’s words, I was simply making a statement
And the party chat comment wasn’t directed at you.
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I apologize if I seemed aggressive, I understand where you're coming from. It can indeed feel repetitive at times, such is the nature of long-standing discussions. =)
Thank you. I understand how topics such as this are very repetitive, which is fine and I have no issues with that. However when it goes on for so long while the same conclusions, reasons and so forth are presented and elaborated time and time again, that's when it starts getting old.
- the party chat comment wasn’t directed at you.
That's alright, in return it allowed me to better explain my stance on it.
This is my best suggestion with this seeing as I'm rather middle of the road with putting it back in or keeping it out. As I've said in the past, due to the nature that General Chat is, and with everything that could go right or wrong with it, the only real way to tell if it'll do well, with everything good and bad that's been said about it, is if you put it back into the game and see how it does. If it does great and everyone likes it, no issues, then that's great. If it does well but has some issues, possibly those issues will open up different ways to change it and make it better. If it doesn't do well, then either find a way to change it to see how it works, or once again remove it all together. Any decision on the matter is fine by me.
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I've read through the responses of this thread and understand most of the thoughts and concerns around this topic.
I will be honest in saying that I do miss General chat, and I don't see why we shouldn't bring it back. It did have its pros and cons, but I never saw it has too much of a bad place to chat with people. Yes, there were people who did abuse it by posting spam, trolling, and bring some questionable topics into the chat. I've even seen hostility go down in General in the past, but it would sort out either with the users blocking one another or a moderator stepping in to handle the situation.
Isn't it like this with local chat too? Let's face it, things like this can occur in any chat within this game. There will always be people who will try to spoil things for everyone, but it's up to us as individuals to act accordingly to handle these situations.
Some say they don't want General Chat back because people will abuse it by spamming, trolling, breaking rules, younger players "not knowing better", etc. There are solutions for most of those problems. Back in the old days, if someone were to spam in General, I would just BLOCK that user temporarily, or I would turn General chat off. That block button, and the options to turn off certain chat channels are there for a reason. If someone were breaking the rules in General chat by swearing or bringing up a topic that has no place in the game, I would either BLOCK them or REPORT them, if necessary. The moderators were not always around to see these rule breakers, so it was up to us the players to send in a report so they could be dealt with. Don't we do the same things for Local chat too? If we see someone spamming, trolling, in local chat, we would do the same thing, right? How would General be any different? A moderator is not going to be around 24/7. That's just a fact of life. When they're not around, it's up to us to report any rule breakers and bring it to the attention of the staff.
For those who brought up the concern of younger or newer players not knowing how to use General chat, why not teach them? That's what happened when I was a new player here. The more experienced players taught me of the different chats and how to use them.
I don't see why we can't have General Chat back. As others have said, most other MMO games have these kind of chats for a reason, so why can't we have it again? Yes, it had pros and cons, but it's the same with any other chat game. It's just up to us the players on how we handle the situations we come across.
In any case it would be nice to have General Chat back.
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Before I add anything, I'd like to preface and say that I joined a year after general's removal, so I don't think I can give a really accurate input on the whole "does the game need it or just want it really badly" debate. But I will say that we shouldn't level this at the staff, as Kerriki said they have also been pushing for it.
Instead, let's direct them to Raz. Because at the end of the day, he makes the final decision, and he's the only one who has the answers to all our questions (even if he doesn't want to answer them).
And if we get ignored, well, actions certainly do speak volumes, and we may just have to finally let the discussion die.
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I'm not going to type a few paragraphs here explaining why general chat should return. In fact, I believe the game needs it to return. I've wanted it back for a long time now. I've come here to clarify a common misconception instead...
The majority of staff have at one point or another expressed wanting general's return; so why hasn't it? Raz does not find our (or anyone's) concerns/arguments valid. I ask that you turn to him, and not us, because for a long time now the staff haven't been the ones against it
Before I add anything, I'd like to preface and say that I joined a year after general's removal, so I don't think I can give a really accurate input on the whole "does the game need it or just want it really badly" debate. But I will say that we shouldn't level this at the staff, as Kerriki said they have also been pushing for it.
Instead, let's direct them to Raz. Because at the end of the day, he makes the final decision, and he's the only one who has the answers to all our questions (even if he doesn't want to answer them).
And if we get ignored, well, actions certainly do speak volumes, and we may just have to finally let the discussion die.
IF at this point the staff have gotten nowhere with Raz on general, and the fact he is hardly responding at all except with what he did yesterday on Jango's post, maybe that in itself is an answer and exactly what Lemon said, we should just let the discussion die.
Why does everyone keep beating a dead horse over it? I admit, I would like to experience it. I myself have even made a thread on the matter. But it's the same with every thread about bringing General back. It is mostly ignored cause Raz could care less about what we want on the matter.
Kerriki is right on the matter that....he really doesn't care what the community wants. And the sad thing is, we just have to accept that. And just keep going. Discussions are great and all, but we're obviously getting nowhere with it.
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I'm not going to type a few paragraphs here explaining why general chat should return. In fact, I believe the game needs it to return. I've wanted it back for a long time now. I've come here to clarify a common misconception instead...
The majority of staff have at one point or another expressed wanting general's return; so why hasn't it? Raz does not find our (or anyone's) concerns/arguments valid. I ask that you turn to him, and not us, because for a long time now the staff haven't been the ones against it
Before I add anything, I'd like to preface and say that I joined a year after general's removal, so I don't think I can give a really accurate input on the whole "does the game need it or just want it really badly" debate. But I will say that we shouldn't level this at the staff, as Kerriki said they have also been pushing for it.
Instead, let's direct them to Raz. Because at the end of the day, he makes the final decision, and he's the only one who has the answers to all our questions (even if he doesn't want to answer them).
And if we get ignored, well, actions certainly do speak volumes, and we may just have to finally let the discussion die.
IF at this point the staff have gotten nowhere with Raz on general, and the fact he is hardly responding at all except with what he did yesterday on Jango's post, maybe that in itself is an answer and exactly what Lemon said, we should just let the discussion die.
Why does everyone keep beating a dead horse over it? I admit, I would like to experience it. I myself have even made a thread on the matter. But it's the same with every thread about bringing General back. It is mostly ignored cause Raz could care less about what we want on the matter.
Kerriki is right on the matter that....he really doesn't care what the community wants. And the sad thing is, we just have to accept that. And just keep going. Discussions are great and all, but we're obviously getting nowhere with it.
Pretty much sums up what I was trying to say, simplified and very easily read, aside from the suggestion that I threw out there. This has been brought up time and time again, and at every turn it fails. The only person that could ever change this is Raz it seems. What I've said to someone in PM is that, Raz holds the final say on this. You can tell by what he does and how he reacts he's gotten this thrown at him so many times, and yet every time he's stuck to his guns. It's clear he's not going to budge. So at this point, it's best we leave it be. Maybe sometime in the future he would be willing to agree to put it back into the game, but that's merely just a highly unlikely thought.
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IF at this point the staff have gotten nowhere with Raz on general, and the fact he is hardly responding at all except with what he did yesterday on Jango's post, maybe that in itself is an answer and exactly what Lemon said, we should just let the discussion die.
Why does everyone keep beating a dead horse over it? I admit, I would like to experience it. I myself have even made a thread on the matter. But it's the same with every thread about bringing General back. It is mostly ignored cause Raz could care less about what we want on the matter.
Kerriki is right on the matter that....he really doesn't care what the community wants. And the sad thing is, we just have to accept that. And just keep going. Discussions are great and all, but we're obviously getting nowhere with it.
we literally just kickstarted the conversation again in the past two months.
quitting because of a vague thread lock is
dumb.
speaking for raz and assuming his stance on things is also dumb.
sure, you could turn his whole thing of 'actions speak louder than words' into saying maybe he doesn't and that's why he won't add a global chat
but i'm not, personally.
just because the going gets tough doesn't mean you should give up.
hella disappointed in the 'let it die' attitude. especially since this is normally a community that sticks through it all and perseveres through whatever is thrown at it.
kinda weird.
im pretty sure most of this wasn't being leveled at staff either, but was moreso put out because last one got yeet.
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Not "speaking for Raz" or "Assuming his stance" at all. Everyone has seen for themselves how he feels about it.
Maybe we should have have a new approach. Something he would approve of as well.
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I'm going to say what I think and how I feel about a lot of things as bluntly as possible.
FeralHeart is dying, and even considered already "dead" by a lot of members as well. As a community we all have an deserve the right to speak on things and discuss them together as anybody would discuss politics IRL. This game needs any and everything it can get to attract new and old members.
Sure General Chat may have been a PAIN in the butt to keep up with, but as many people have said.. there are solutions to control it and keep it from getting out of hand. Every MMO needs a chat to be able to chat throughout the map, we have a way to turn it off, we have a way to block people, and we have a way to REPORT people? So why don't we use it?
Even STAFF agree that it should return, so why shouldn't it?
I'm not entirely sure what "Actions speak volumes" was suppose to mean, considering.. A lot of members in-game have chilled out a lot over the years, everyone is older now. Of course there are those few random newbies who get a little out of control, but it's easy to manage, it is easy to fix. Point these members in the direction of the rules, kick them temporarily so they learn. If so many members are asking for it's return, why can't we give it a test run and see how that goes?
I could go on and say more but it seems everyone has covered it. This game is almost entirely dead and if we don't do something to get new and old members in, we might as well just be killing it off ourselves.
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Not going to reply to everything mentioned but I will say I respectfully, but strongly, disagree with some various statements from the opposition. I am, however, delighted both sides have responded and are actively conversing (even if it's to say stop discussing General... hehe).
Kerriki is right on the matter that....he really doesn't care what the community wants. And the sad thing is, we just have to accept that. And just keep going. Discussions are great and all, but we're obviously getting nowhere with it.
This... This is what bugs me. We shouldn't have to accept that, as angsty and rebellious as it may sound. In order to maintain a respectable reputation, Feralheart's heads should be prepared to take in ideas from the outside and elaborate on them.
Feralheart does not have any room to suddenly make a breakthrough (mainly because the creator is absent, as we all know—not going to get into this) so even these discussions that may seem irrelevant 'in the big scheme of things' are serious, as they have the potential to drive away long-time members—something FH desperate needs to maintain any sort of reliable fan base. Massive MMOs can afford to lose an amount of older, trusted members, but FH cannot without taking a serious hit in regards to moving forward. This harkens back to why I remade this thread initially—I wanted to maintain the idea that we are free to discuss our ideas and opinions.
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There is something I learned in Communications a long while ago, and I think it does apply to this situation. This is all I will really say on the rest of this matter, and something I know we all lack, as much as you want to admit it or not. Alpha is right, this may not be in the big scheme of things, but obstacles like these have a potential to make us argue and ruin things for us in the long run.
Now,
There is a large difference between compromise and collaboration.
Compromise is an avoidance tactic. We, right now, are compromising our needs for something else. Backing down is a compromise, but compromise will never be a good thing. Fighting, arguing, and bickering, is never a good thing. That is all I see from everyone right now. Just a bunch of people arguing over wanting the same exact thing.
When the going gets tough, we as a community all start pointing fingers. "Raz did this," "She did that," and "They did this."
That's what's going on right now, and there is honestly no reason. From ANYONE. We all want the same thing, but we all have a different way or different opinion on how to approach it, so why are we arguing exactly?
We are all compromising, when we should be collaborating. Working with each other, because we all want the same thing, not working against each other because our opinions on how to solve it are different. Collaboration is putting those differing ideas together, and making something new. Instead of bickering with each other, take a step back, and explore the options you have to collaborate. No one here is insane, and no one here is out to hurt anyone. We all want the best for the game, just different ideas on how to make the best of it, and that's where we start arguing. We honestly stop looking at the end goal, and bicker over the obstacle currently in front of us. If you really want to help this game thrive, and if you really want to help at all, you will stop arguing over who is right and wrong, and start collaborating on what we can do to help each other over an obstacle.
We are too busy focusing on who is the enemy, too much to a point where we forget that there's truly no enemy in the first place, just an obstacle we have to help each other get over. Remember that.
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i've been playing for long enough to know what the green text was like.
my first experience with it was. not exactly game appropriate but for the most part i saw wholesome interactions and good friends.
and honestly?
i think it should stay where it is. not because it's a bad thing or it doesn't have potential to work in our currently more subdued community but that if something like the spoctor raid were to happen again, we only have so many active staff on at any given time.
hell, that number seems to dwindle down and down as the weeks go on, and that's understandable. because we're all humans with lives and hobbies but i believe we should do something like a test run over the summer. have general up for a couple weeks when our moderating team has time to watch it and they can gauge whether it should make a full return, if our community of old and new players can use it as intended. i leave it up to raz but for now? i don't think it should be around. not yet.
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Maybe we should have have a new approach. Something he would approve of as well.
... like what exactly?
there isn't much that can be done to provide a 'new approach', since uh
there aren't many avenues to take?
except for... waiting?
which is what we're doing?
this discussion is just to add on to the pile of what's been done already, and apart from maybe being annoying isn't doing much harm.
stopping a conversation because we won't find out the thrilling conclusion is silly. let the people talk about general, or else we'll be no better off than we were in 2013-2014 in the hellish iron curtain that fell on anyone wanting to talk about it.
it's healthy.
This... This is what bugs me. We shouldn't have to accept that, as angsty and rebellious as it may sound. In order to maintain a respectable reputation, Feralheart's heads should be prepared to take in ideas from the outside and elaborate on them.
attagirl.
which is why this discussion should still be had - otherwise this weird perpetuation that nothing can be done so let's quit because raz might say no is gonna keep on perpetu it's ating.
let the people talk. when you try to stop the people from talking, they continue and they get louder. and more annoying.
something something streisand effect.
There is a large difference between compromise and collaboration.
Compromise is an avoidance tactic. We, right now, are compromising our needs for something else. Backing down is a compromise, but compromise will never be a good thing. Fighting, arguing, and bickering, is never a good thing. That is all I see from everyone right now. Just a bunch of people arguing over wanting the same exact thing.
When the going gets tough, we as a community all start pointing fingers. "Raz did this," "She did that," and "They did this."
That's what's going on right now, and there is honestly no reason. From ANYONE. We all want the same thing, but we all have a different way or different opinion on how to approach it, so why are we arguing exactly?
attagirl x2
just wanting to highlight it in case people[like me] keep skipping posts and then going back when they realize there was text.
this is also the second time i've tried to write something up and the forum dinged me that there's a new response
i think it should stay where it is. not because it's a bad thing or it doesn't have potential to work in our currently more subdued community but that if something like the spoctor raid were to happen again, we only have so many active staff on at any given time.
now this
this is what i was looking for with the original thread
new critique
and this is a very, very fair concern.
i still wouldn't say it outweighs the good of having a global/region/general/galaxy chat, considering that the population during these raids is about the same as what we used to have in the golden days of FH.
it wouldn't add much to the payload as staff really can't/shouldn't be watching us at all times. mainly because they are people and should take breaks, but also because community members can step up to help out via reports/talking people down gently. it's worked in the past and it can work now.
sorry if this seems scatter brained i kept rewriting this post but peOPLE KEPT TALKING
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No one in any community should be restrained from speaking for themselves and for those who are too afraid to do so. No matter what the topic is. At this point, the concern for FH's survival is why General chat keeps being brought up. No community should NOT be given insight of what the plans are. No community should just be shut out and neglected because one person doesn't like the topic they bring up. No PASSIONATE community should suffer the consequences if a game dies because one person doesn't care about this game's survival and what needs to be done to help it.
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Well then in this case, maybe we can push it till Raz finally gets sick of it and either A). Gives it another chance or B). Keeps locking threads and avoiding the topic like he's been doing so far. Cause according to everyone else, there is no other way to bring FH's activity back except for...General apparently. Or it's one of the main things. And everyone may be right.
General could very well be FH's saving grace. And if it's not brought back because the server master just refuses to bring it back, then what?
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I'm not going to leave a long post here as I feel there's no need to.
All points that have needed to be brought up have been, and most opinions have been shared.
The fact of the matter is that the staff team has been talking about this for quite some time.
What we've come to is this: Raz has given a flat out "no" to bringing general chat back anytime soon.
He feels there are far more important matters at hand before this is given another thought- bigger fish to fry, so to speak.
This is not to say myself or any of the other staff fully agree with the decision, as we all have quite different opinions on the matter itself.
It is simply the response we have been given and I would like to share this with you, to keep things as transparent as possible.
I've truly enjoyed reading all of the perspectives from you folks and personally thank you all for being (mostly) civil about this.
This thread will remain unlocked; you are all welcome (and encouraged!) to continue sharing your opinions. <3
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No one in any community should be restrained from speaking for themselves and for those who are too afraid to do so. No matter what the topic is. At this point, the concern for FH's survival is why General chat keeps being brought up. No community should NOT be given insight of what the plans are. No community should just be shut out and neglected because one person doesn't like the topic they bring up. No PASSIONATE community should suffer the consequences if a game dies because one person doesn't care about this game's survival and what needs to be done to help it.
I actually kind of disagree here, mainly because General is not the main idea behind Feral Heart's survival. It's a subject that has been recycled for decades, mainly because many people disliked the idea of it going away in the first place. It would be nice to have back, surely! I wouldn't mind it coming back at all, but. To think that General is the pinnacle of Feral Heart's survival is a bit well... farfetched.
>> I also want to make it clear I do agree that discussions should be left open and rightfully so. However, mistakes and errors do happen and we shouldn't get too wired up about it.
Again, as I stated before in my previous post said above, I can tell and read into the sourness that's obviously there. Meaning, my point exactly, that everyone is still pointing fingers when we really shouldn't be. The game will not die because of a mistake, and it's crude to assume that this 'one person' spoken of has ill-intentions for the game and it's survival. If this 'one person' truly didn't care about the game's survival, don't you think this game would've ended months ago?
Wolffox is correct in being transparent with the community and outright giving an answer that we perhaps all needed. Thank you, Fox, for keeping civil in this regard, and even though you don't agree with the decision made, it's respectful that you approached it in an easier way.
My point still stands, however. We need to stop pointing fingers. The game won't die due to a disagreement, but due to our negligence of the real objective while we keep tugging at each other's hair trying to pin the blame on someone.
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Why does everyone keep beating a dead horse over it?
Because most users want General to come back. xd
Idk why this is such a rough topic lol it's a chat common among most games with chatrooms. It shouldn't have been removed in the first place.
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No one in any community should be restrained from speaking for themselves and for those who are too afraid to do so. No matter what the topic is. At this point, the concern for FH's survival is why General chat keeps being brought up. No community should NOT be given insight of what the plans are. No community should just be shut out and neglected because one person doesn't like the topic they bring up. No PASSIONATE community should suffer the consequences if a game dies because one person doesn't care about this game's survival and what needs to be done to help it.
I actually kind of disagree here, mainly because General is not the main idea behind Feral Heart's survival. It's a subject that has been recycled for decades, mainly because many people disliked the idea of it going away in the first place. It would be nice to have back, surely! I wouldn't mind it coming back at all, but. To think that General is the pinnacle of Feral Heart's survival is a bit well... farfetched.
>> I also want to make it clear I do agree that discussions should be left open and rightfully so. However, mistakes and errors do happen and we shouldn't get too wired up about it.
Again, as I stated before in my previous post said above, I can tell and read into the sourness that's obviously there. Meaning, my point exactly, that everyone is still pointing fingers when we really shouldn't be. The game will not die because of a mistake, and it's crude to assume that this 'one person' spoken of has ill-intentions for the game and it's survival. If this 'one person' truly didn't care about the game's survival, don't you think this game would've ended months ago?
Wolffox is correct in being transparent with the community and outright giving an answer that we perhaps all needed. Thank you, Fox, for keeping civil in this regard, and even though you don't agree with the decision made, it's respectful that you approached it in an easier way.
My point still stands, however. We need to stop pointing fingers. The game won't die due to a disagreement, but due to our negligence of the real objective while we keep tugging at each other's hair trying to pin the blame on someone.
You've misinterpreted my post here,
I said no one should be restrained on bringing up discussions, no matter what the topic is. I didn't mean to pinpoint General as FH's key to survival, I was supposed to insinuate that it would play a role worthy of giving a try and just seeing how it goes. It's a feature of FH that the community dearly misses.
I stand by what I said for specific reasons I'll not share.
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Well then in this case, maybe we can push it till Raz finally gets sick of it and either A). Gives it another chance or B). Keeps locking threads and avoiding the topic like he's been doing so far. Cause according to everyone else, there is no other way to bring FH's activity back except for...General apparently. Or it's one of the main things. And everyone may be right.
General could very well be FH's saving grace. And if it's not brought back because the server master just refuses to bring it back, then what?
I have to agree with this.
We have all entered into this discussion with an open mind and despite others saying that we are, "beating a dead horse," I still find the conversation at hand a lesser debate that has grown into something it shouldn't have become, although the various perspectives and opinions of members show the community coming together to converse over what they may believe could benefit, or not benefit Feral-Heart. If we continue to push Raz to this "breaking point" and finally expect that he will one day bring back the general chat, he could simply not do anything at all and blatantly disregard the entire thread, lock it, and go about his day. Azura made a dashing point that many posts prior have mentioned how "Feral-Heart NEEDS General chat to LIVE" when it doesn't.
Feral-Heart has lived on, even after General Chat was removed. Let's say it was removed some-time in 2013. Therefore, Feral-Heart held onto General Chat for around 3/4 years. Feral-Heart from then on, 2013-2019, has been the span of around 6/7 years ? About that long. Here are some incidents that have perhaps, just a thought, decreased Feral-Heart's activity over the years --
* The Hacker incident years back caused a great havoc within our Community. Players were banned, and staff were working over-time to maintain safety of the players. The hackers made a twitter account where they garnered a following, and they proceeded to meme the game out of this dimension.
* New Log-in page to play the game - a multitude, or perhaps many members have quit the game due to this. Although, would you rather feel safe and protected ? Raz implemented this as an alternative way to continue playing the game while making a way to keep out hackers. New log-in page design is also quite dashing, don't you think?
* New Update (2016 , New maps rendition) - all old maps were removed, players no longer feel like they should stay with Feral-Heart because it is changing waaaay too much for their liking. People want old maps back, debates occur, old maps do not return. Feral-Heart continues to move on with new update.
* Change, in general. - Old players have retired from the game, therefore a lot of the community has lessened to a younger audience, however Feral-Heart has always had a younger audience, just a little bit more with change, kids still like the game. No more mate center, adoption center? Apparently few find it now boring. No more pride rock? Can't throw Fake yellow simba off the cliff? No longer would like to play.
People hate change, and that's just how it will be. Feral-Heart continues to move on, and it shouldn't focus on the past to maintain it's "survival." The game itself is a big nostalgia for older players and will always be a resort for home. I don't oppose General returning at all, however we're big on whether Raz will act upon what we ask for. Staff have shared their disappoint for not being able to return General back to the community, but there is only so much that we can do.
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I’m not going to try and express my opinion because I’m afraid I make no sense at all... lol. Sorry.
I find many people here having it like it’s nothing to write a post with 15 lines, but not for me. I just can’t. I want to but I can’t. Especially that some can easily use fine words like “blatantly” “misinterpred” “compromise” “dwindled”, and way many more... Period. :/
What I can say is I’m for the general chat to come back...
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The fact of the matter is that the staff team has been talking about this for quite some time.
What we've come to is this: Raz has given a flat out "no" to bringing general chat back anytime soon.
He feels there are far more important matters at hand before this is given another thought- bigger fish to fry, so to speak.
With what you've said, it only leads me to feel as if Raz wants to look at other things first, then consider and speak about General once them bigger fish have been fried and made into nice sushi roles. If this is so, then I say focus on other things for the time being, then bring General back up at a later point with him. I'm not saying to stop discussions entirely; continue to your heart's content, but to pull other things together first rather than pushing a topic that he's already stated his opinion on. Again from what you said, it feels like he might comply later once other things have been taken care of. That is of course only assuming from second hand information.
To think that General is the pinnacle of Feral Heart's survival is a bit well... farfetched.
I agree with Cal here. There are multiple other factors that way in on FeralHeart's survival. Not just one chat option. General plays a part in it, but it's not the make or break decision of this game we all call home.
- it's crude to assume that this 'one person' spoken of has ill-intentions for the game and it's survival. If this 'one person' truly didn't care about the game's survival, don't you think this game would've ended months ago?
My point still stands, however. We need to stop pointing fingers. The game won't die due to a disagreement, but due to our negligence of the real objective while we keep tugging at each other's hair trying to pin the blame on someone.
Bottom line, if Raz didn't care for this game, FeralHeart would most likely be long gone by now. If he didn't care, he wouldn't have done some of the things I've been able to see through my time here on the forum. If Raz says that you should maybe try tackling other issues first before addressing the General Chat, maybe it wouldn't hurt to tackle those things first and get it done and settled. If anything, it's not about what we want. It's about what's best for FeralHeart as a whole.
I'm not saying General shouldn't be put back into the game just because we want it back, and I'm not saying that is our soul intention that "we just want it back to have it back." What I'm saying is, if it will better FeralHeart to have it or not, the best decision needs to be made on the matter so FeralHeart CAN live and continue on into the many years ahead.
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General's removal is absolutely not the reason why FeralHeart has been more and more inactive. As someone who's been through the thick and thin with this game it definitely has to do with other factors.
Like the fact that the registration's has been closed 80% of the time for like 2 years BUT WE CAN'T TALK ABOUT THAT shh
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typing this up quickly but i keep seeing this 'bigger fish to fry' thing being brought up
i have to ask
what bigger fish are there to fry
we just had a patch in recent months and honestly that should not take top priority every single time, or else NOTHING will get done at all.
i'd say that the general chat issue is DEFINITELY one of the bigger fish, considering it's been something brought up consistently for years.
apart from a small handful almost everyone has the same feelings towards it and has been conveying those feelings for years.
what about this does not make it at least one of the top priorities?
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Telling that to Raz though is like talking to a brick wall. Getting nowhere with it.
I don't know what else to do though. I mean, people have been talking about it for years, making threads, the like. We just have to find a way to convince him that bringing General back may help things....
Hmmm....
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Raz said to us yesterday, and I quote exactly; "Its not somthing thats even on the horision until after other more pressing matters are completed"
Which... honestly would have been a more polite and elaborate way to end a thread before locking it. But, I just hope everyone's opinion of other staff hasn't changed because of the blunt decision to lock the thread as his overall 'opinion' which was rude and unnecessary. But, moving on. Gonna shake that off.
All though a lot of people would like to see General Chat coming back right now, I have to agree that there would be a better time to bring it back. For starters, more active in-game staff which there seems to be a lack of. Staff that can actively moderate the General Chat and sort out any issues more often in real-time rather than rely on self-moderation. It's needed because users are definitely going to listen to staff rather than users, who they will more than likely talk back at.
Now I know some may think that reporting may be enough, but sometimes it really isn't. You are all capable of being really good influences, but the things I see said in Local Chat these days (let alone General Chat) would often require a mod's attention to get them out of the game rather than continuing to cause more drama and issues for everyone else. Right now it's fine the way it is because Local Chat doesn't reach further than maybe almost half way through The Grounds distance wise. This is the exact reason why we need more active in-game staff. Staff who are able to spend some parts of their day talking to people, being a good influence for the General Chat and being there to moderate it while it starts back again. Right now, sadly, I don't think we have that.
Honestly, I really think there is a better time to bring it back than now, because right now it's hit and miss. It could either go terribly wrong or will go fairly okay, and I'd rather wait until there's a better opening for it to actually come back rather than now when there's a possibility it'll just get taken away again for the lack of a good start it needs with active in-game staff moderation. I can't stress it enough really, and I don't want to particularly hear anything about it from anyone because right now it's going in circles and it's going to get to the point where it won't come back at all because of how irresponsible people can be with what they say and how they can't take "no, not right now" for an answer. It's not like it's "no, not ever".
People eventually got Raz's opinion, which was said at the very beginning of this post.
Please leave it at "not now, but when there's a better opening" rather than pushing it to "not now, not ever" and then end up in a big sulk.
Sorry to be transparent with you all, but it is what it is now.
Maybe send your energy over to this thread (https://feral-heart.com/smf/index.php?topic=65912.msg906261#msg906261) instead. It'll be a better use of your time.
Thanks.
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Well he needs to just tell us that instead of his vague statements he gives and just giving off the idea that he doesn't give a crap what we want.
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Yeah he's made it clear to us that he doesn't care what people think of him and it's not going to change unfortunately, so I guess Staff/MotS can quote things he says as there's no point in trying to get someone involved with topics they don't want to actively be involved in/reply to properly.
It's a shame.
But.
Complaining about that now isn't going to change that.
I just encourage staff to quote from him in future from now on rather than speak on... his behalf? so things are more legitimate and in 'his writing' as much as possible, even if it's not from him directly.
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I understand Razmirz is a busy man and might not be that open but he should at least try to be transparent. No spite towards him, but after what happened a few months ago he should at least learned a bit about what his community wants, which was being less vauge.
I understand (and agree) that their are more important things to do other than revive General chat, but afaik I don't see anything on the horizon as a mere regular member...
I feel weird talking about someone like this, but like how several people said that's just how it is gonna be for now.
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Well now Bawful you just took the words right from my mouth before I could write them down. Or...my fingers, per se.
This is why I say, after getting an explanation, just leave it be and tackle other things first. I can't see what things exactly, but all I can do is trust your, and Raz's words that there are bigger things to take care of first.
As you've said, I agree right now in this very time frame would not be a good idea to bring it back due to not that many active in-game staff- thank you for explaining everything by the way. Referencing a previous post of mine, that's why I said "- imagine having to monitor BOTH chats blowing up" as something like General coming back would need a watchful eye over. I don't have hardly any staff on my friends list, but it kind of upsets me not seeing the ones I do have online, or not spotting others around aside from one, and generally two others from time-to-time. Not treating General chat as Local chat, but as Bawful said, the things said in local need a mod's attention as they are most likely to find their way into General as well. With my time online and talking to others, I can very much agree to this. It is very clear that they will not listen to another mere member, aside from the very few who heeded my warning when informing them about the rules. Whenever I found myself in those situations however, all I could really do to help the issue was to back down and let them go about before calming down on their own. Basically, one of those small situations where a mod could give them a warning, but not enough for them to be kicked or anything major, aside from escalating the moderation appropriately when need be if they don't comply. Reporting them after the fact wouldn't do as much as catching them in the act, in my eyes.
I agree with quoting Raz rather than, for lack of better words, speak for him on issues. This is why I don't like it when people won't talk to me directly about something involving myself. Things easily get mixed around, rumors can start, and everything is all jumbled. I don't have any ill feelings about Raz, and from what I've heard and seen, it feels like he's trying to do his best to help keep this place alive just as much as the next person.
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I will always be pro-General chat. Yes, there were a few people who actively tried ruining it for everyone else, but that's what the block button is there for. Some of my fondest non-RP and non-map-exploring/making memories are with General chat--sometimes even with the staff. One of my favorite moments, which I screenshot, was when there was some argument starting in General and one of the staff completely disarmed it by saying in red angry text, "Calm down and talk about unicorns instead." I think most of General started losing it (as in laughing) at that point. XD Having out of nowhere conversations that are entertaining, making connections with someone all the way across the map without having to be directly next to them or otherwise in Local range was a lot of fun. I do miss it and hope that it one day makes a return.