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On the off chance the king himself sees this, here we go:
Dear Raz,
It’s common knowledge that you frankly don’t care much for the game itself. You’re just power hungry. You like being #1, you like having people wait on your response —when you literally have no intention of responding to them anyway, you like forcing the staff to go through you first, you like making us wait. You obviously get off on that. It’s gross and NO ONE has respect for you. You need to let go and pass the authority down to someone who will keep up with the game, who will let it grow, who will listen to the community.
Stop playing around.
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honestly lmao youre right. the staff is gonna delete this entire post but youre right
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I understand your frustration with Raz.
While at times he really doesn't seem like the best of people, he is not actually as bad as everyone makes him out to be. Being the administrator for this game is not very easy. He is doing this without pay and is keeping up with his life/job while he does this. We are actually quite lucky and should be thankful that he decided to stay with this game so it didn't shut down. He was ready to give the game up a few months ago, and if he did, we wouldn't have this game today.
His reasoning behind him not leaving the game for someone else is because of the amount of work and information that the new person would have to deal with. He straight up said that it is difficult for him to find someone to replace him because finding someone that he can trust enough not to ruin the game.
I'd recommend taking a look at this post here: https://feral-heart.com/smf/index.php?topic=66651.0 - It might change your thoughts a bit, but I do understand if this doesn't change your thoughts what-so-ever. Raz is a tough person to like upon first glance, but deep down he does care for this game/community - it is just hard to see sometimes. c:
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This isn't the first time this sort of thread has been created in the past, and while I think it can be a good place to start with discussion and debate, the way in which you go about it also matters.
You're completely entitled to your opinion and I'm not really here to so much change it, but to provide at least some details and context. I agree wholeheartedly that he should be around more, give the staff and dev team some guidance instead of leaving them in the dark of planning, and not really being here to provide steps for the crew move forward with the game. Raz is and always has been the guy who wants to work behind the scenes, keep the server running and just generally keeping things going. There can't be steps going forward until we have him around and able to just talk about things. I understand the frustration and I can say with certainty things can be done differently, at least for the sake of Feral Heart's future.
I can't say I'd know what that is and it isn't so much about that. I do think it's an unfair assumption that he doesn't care about the game. He does, if he didn't he would of just shut it down at the first whiff of posts like these. He still wants there to be a community and to have this place for people. Even if it were much preferred that he exercised that care more by being present. It does come in other ways.
And this isn't me white knighting but just stating what's known. Unfortunately we don't know the extent of it, we've only seen the cracks in the foundation of what that is. You can judge things as they are, that's fine, but at least consider some factors. It isn't as black and white as it may seem, nothing ever truly is. We will just have to wait and see what the future holds, and by then we can hope that things become clearer and more transparent.
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Raz is not a robot. Like everybody else, Raz is human.
Unless you are fully, 100% aware as to why he is currently MIA, unavailable, unreachable, it's best to not jump down his throat with assumptions. Doing so breeds toxicity, spreads false rumours, all the while degrading who he is and what he stands for. This is not a fair way to demand answers, nor a well-mannered one.
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While I get the concern about the game, especially in its current state, I don’t agree with the tone of this thread or the assumptions made about Raz.
Raz not caring? Eh, it may seem that way to most but I wouldn’t want us to assume that either whether it’s truth or not. He has always intervened when things got too messy. I don’t always agree with his approach or his solutions to matters but we should still take notice that he hasn’t just shut the server down entirely for good yet. There must be some good reason? Even when he shut it down temporarily he spent a long time struggling thinking of the next best way to handle FH, hence those long thread posts some time back. He knows a lot of people would be unhappy if it was shut down completely. My theory is is that it’s more of a matter of him just being tired and done with it and anything to do with it. The thing is he can’t just let it go as he doesn’t have anyone he would trust handed it down to. He’s always been very protective of user security.
As for my personal opinion on certain responses on this matter:
I don’t think it’s as much of an issue about Raz needing to be around to provide the staff/devs with guidance. We don’t need guidance, what we need is perhaps more trust and liberty to do the things we see fit when and how we want to. Staff & devs aren’t blind without Raz’s guidance, in fact if we didn’t need to rely so much on his approval for things there wouldn’t be a need for guidance. The guidance issue only becomes a thing when Raz sets up projects that he wants done if he doesn’t tell us exactly how HE wants HIS projects done.
Normally staff & devs would listen and take feedback from the community to work for the community not the server master. Under preferable circumstances Staff & devs would then formulate what needs to be done via the community feedback and decide if the community requests and needs are within feasible and functional limits. This should be done without the need for Raz’s constant guidance or sole approval. If a staff/dev team constantly needs guidance from one person then they’re not a successful or functional staff/dev team. Instead you’ll get a team that is constantly reliant on one person and you’ll get a slow down if not entire halt in production. There’s a lot of things staff/devs want to do but can’t necessarily do on our own because it would require access and update to server side things... aka only things Raz can do, thus only Raz can approve of. So essentially anything that requires big changes to things like the game & site are entirely up to Raz. It’s not that we don’t have ideas and a strong will to do things but it’s just not possible unless Raz is aware to it, accepting of it, and available to even pass it through.
In the meantime we can only do the things we have access & permission to. Aka like forum/game events, parties, and Raz assigned/Raz approved tasks.
Not much else to say unfortunately.
My only way of understanding why things are the way they are is because perhaps Raz lacks the trust to hand his job down to anyone else. Plus no one really that he might trust has the skills. So Raz is essentially stuck in a predicament where he doesn’t want to let us all down but he also doesn’t want to feel stuck and obligated to work with FH if he’s tired and too busy for it.
I’m sure like everyone else here we wish circumstances were different and better for all of us here on FH. But for now, all there is to do is to hold out and work with what we have. I’m sorry it’s like this. I don’t think anyone would purposefully want it this way, but do always take into consideration all the possible reasons for things before jumping to any conclusions <3
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(https://i.imgur.com/R4FMi2j.gif)
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I still stand by my initial post, peace bruh
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I still stand by my initial post, peace bruh
I'm sorry, but with that attitude, making a decent reply like the others is not worth my time lol
It doesn't seem that you would bother to understand or even acknowledge what people posted.
I'm really tired
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I had no idea this stuff was even happening to be completely honest--
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If Raz was really that bad, I don't think the staff would stick around. Unless you know him personally I'd say you shouldn't assume things like that. He's not a machine, he's human, as Scally has said. I understand users aren't satisfied with how things are running, but that doesn't mean he deserves these kinds of things said about/to him. He could shut down FH, or he could dump it on someone who has no experience in that area, but he hasn't, and he won't, so think about that. Things could be so much worse than they are.
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(https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/887/136/40d.gif)
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If Raz was really that bad, I don't think the staff would stick around.
Are we tho? I'm pretty sure the reason the staff is still around is not Raz but the community.
What is happening is clearly:
3. Drop the project back to how LKD designed it and pretty much abandon it to run itself. (Just without actually dopping back to 1.13)
(https://feral-heart.com/smf/index.php?topic=66651.0)
To be perfectly honest I really don't think Raz cares anymore at all. After all he told Ellen, that if he would care he'd throw a tantrum and shut the game down. I kinda feel like he is kinda even trying to say that we should be thankful lol
He abandoned the game and most likely he won't come back.
He doesn't answer any staff members anymore. No matter how or when we are trying to reach him (even if we text him the same time as he is talking to a normal user) he will not answer. It's kinda funny to think that he talks more to normal users than staff lol (Even tho he became annoyed as soon as a user mentioned FH instead of just chatting about stuff related to him)
FH is already on the dying side. There is no need to shadow that. I doubt there would be anyways to save it now.
There won't even be any updates most likely... Since Raz is ignoring the progress of the community map makers as well I can assure you there won't be an update.
At this rate FH probably won't last until this fall.
But probably I should shut up... Before I end up becoming the one to blame once a raging news thread about everyone being an *awful person* shows up lol
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After all he told Ellen, that if he would care he'd throw a tantrum and shut the game down.
This is just me but, I do believe she meant it in the way of, if he took things people say about him to heart, he would throw a tantrum.
"Raz once told me if he took things to the heart, he would throw a tantrum and shut the server down.
But he doesn't care what people says about him. He has grown a thick skin over the years. And he says no one would understand him anyway."
I can't speak for either of them, nor am I tryin to lmao
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Feral Heart isn't dying, I've actually seen it have more members recently. New people are joining every month, even every week! It's been getting closer to 300 members recently. Currently, 190/180/170...etc
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(https://media.giphy.com/media/kaq6GnxDlJaBq/giphy.gif)
So many things to say, but cba to repeat myself.
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I do think X has a valid point. He's been very helpful in telling people what's going on and it makes sense to me. Feral Heart may not have it's chance to survive because it's window keeps getting smaller and smaller to grow into something more than what it already is. And it all comes back to Raz just not being present. I'd like to reiterate and clarify what I said earlier as I think I was misunderstood to a degree (which is understandable, I may not be the best at articulating my thoughts well)-
It's not so much we need him around for guidance because he isn't the person to provide that, he's a behind the scenes guy, but he needs to be able just be present? I'm not talking around the clock and constantly on your back, but at least have the guy around to just talk about upcoming patches and to make sure it's something he'd want to put in and also at least have some trust in his staff team. They're here for a reason and they want to help the game grow as much as the next person. But he clearly doesn't trust them enough to take charge, and that itself is just the tip of the ice berg. I don't blame them at all, they actually care about the community and they do want to have their best interests at heart, but they can't have that if they aren't trusted enough to take the lead on other things other than events for the community.
Feral Heart has managed to stay a strong community for years, but because of a lot of factors it's grown to be a bit small. Feral Heart as also been through a lot of big blows, drama that erupts into this because of just this. Not enough trust or open lines to communication, and it gets out into the community far too easily, and then it just creates this divide, and divides only make things worse and puts everything in black and white. Making it so people's views and thoughts on all sides invalidated, there won't be room for healthy discussion and growth like that.
But I think this is the biggest one yet until we have some confirmation to go off of and to work on things going forward. But like I said, the longer we wait, the smaller the window gets and unfortunately, Feral Heart may not have it's fighting chance.
We've all been down this road before, this thread I mean. And I remember when I even so much suggest that the community deserves a bridge of communication, it was put down. I don't doubt my preaching about this whole thing would be as well, but that's alright. Take all of this as someone whose heard some sides of it, I don't know the full extent of the situation but this is only an assumption and my opinions toward it. Correct me if you see it fit. And I'm not trying to rag on the game or say "it must die", I'm just talking out of concern for a game I care about.
I hope we can still have a good discussion about this situation, even if the thread wasn't really made with those intentions. Talking about things in a way that's productive can at least help find common ground, we all want one thing, and it's for Feral Heart to succeed.
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Feral Heart isn't dying, I've actually seen it have more members recently. New people are joining every month, even every week! It's been getting closer to 300 members recently. Currently, 190/180/170...etc
That's almost nothing next to what it had a few months or years ago. Also, Those are the mainly USA based users. In the EU we are down to like 40-80 users at best. Aaaand we might have new members but how many of them stays? FH has almost nothing to offer besides the community events (parties, movie nights etc).
Even if we have like almost 200 players everyday, how many of those 200 will stay if FH will get no updates for the coming months, years?
I'm not trying to be against FH here. I'd like it to survive and get big updates for years. But facts are facts, and the fact is that in it's currect state FH is not working well.
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Spirit has pretty much summed up how I feel. Years ago there was over 700 players online at a time and even reaching into the thousands, crashing the game. But so much has changed and people either grow up and leave or abandon the game because they don't want to be a part of all of it's drama. FeralHeart has not kept pace with the times, we're still pretty much stuck in the 2012s but with different maps and a few small changes. Some people are happy with how the game is now, but for the ones who've been around since the beginning, some of us are seeing the game crash and burn before our eyes.
I'm sure Raz is a cool guy, but the decisions he makes aren't so cool. If he wants to be a background man, then he needs to give the staff and future devs power to make their own stuff. Let the community decide if they want it or not. He doesn't want General back, yet there are have been so many threads about people begging it to come back because no one wants to be crowded around one area to talk to each other. There are a lot of things that I am sure the staff would love to change, but they can't without his single "yes" or "no" and he doesn't have the time to even send them that.
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I know you left, Spirit, and by what you're saying I'm assuming it's because of Raz's lack of communication, and I know that the other staff stay for the community just like most of us do. And I also understand why people feel the way they do, but the future is unpredictable. I remain hopeful nonetheless.
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Honestly, I am with Sigynx on this one. No one can tell what the future will bring and it is important for people of this game/community to remain hopeful about it. Personally, I do think that more people are being attracted to this game every day. It also seems as if the old users are returning/are active. It is difficult to predict what will happen, but it really could go either way.
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As a returning user I can say I have hope for this game. Even if at times Raz can be a little rash, I don't see it "dying" any time soon.
Though I do quite miss when there were more people playing, especially in the EU.
I think the staff are trying their hardest to keep the community alive and I really appreciate it. but all we can do right now is hope things will go okay.
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I agree with the three last posts here, honestly. I've been saying for a while now that I noticed a lot of FH's older users returning. Now, I know FH doesn't have as many people as we wanted it to have, however any increase is a increase nonetheless. Gathering the old users' return, the addition of new users and the fact FH has it's source code back has me about as hyper for this game as I'd be around 2011-2012, when FeralHeart was just taking it's first steps. If anything, the game feels like the figure of the Phoenix for me at the moment - Rebirthing from what for most would be considered 'ashes'.
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i don't mind the stagnation. i do mind the idea of losing one of my favorite games.
i'm aware these are concepts that go hand in hand but i will stand by my statement.
i know this is a very controversial thing to say and i understand staff have a different perspective and so do players from all different years.
tired of all the people who are standing on opposite sides of a fence and yelling how the game is or isn't dying. sure they are too.
i want to have hope for fh [and to an extent i do. i wouldn't log in pretty much every night if i didn't and i will keep doing so until i can't no more.] i love this game and this community. i feel like i belong here and i'm not alone in that regard. i don't care what happens within the higher up circles. whether we get a new server master or coder or whatever whatever, i can't be bothered. i just do not want to lose fh. and i am not alone in this regard.
i wish raz would breathe and realize he can trust more people than he thinks, but on the opposite side of the coin, trust is a years long process.
sigh.
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But probably I should shut up... Before I end up becoming the one to blame once a raging news thread about everyone being an *awful person* shows up lol
LMFAO. Spirit, I admire your truthfulness and transparency, along with the rest of the development team bringing updates. I appreciate that you tell it how it is and don’t sugar over the major problems this game has. You do not deserve any blame.
I have almost no hope for this game. The hope I do have rests in the developers, but without Raz or another server master, this game will die. There is no denying that. But why would Raz want to come back here? Is it worth his energy? Only he can really answer that, and considering he is MIA, I would argue “no.” It is heartbreaking but without his presence, the game will not last much longer.
This game is continuing solely off of nostalgia—there is little to no new audience at this point. Neither is there a reason for any new one given the game’s circumstances.
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This game is dead. End of story.
The people you guys praise aren't really that great ether.
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After knowing most of them for 8 years, I beg to differ.
I think this thread is becoming too negative.
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Yea. I can be considered a new audience! I joined in 2018, from all the old FeralHeart videos floating around. Let's try and keep it positive! Many new players are joining every week, there's a lot of new audience anyways!
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I do have to wonder... if the staff are as frustrated with Raz's position as xSpirit implies, why have you guys not just... taken over FH by now? You have the source, you could all withdraw and go make your own server with it if you really wanted to, and legally, Raz would have literally 0 power to stop you or do anything about it as he is not the legal copyright holder of the FH source.
So if Raz is THIS overbearing, and this uncaring, as you say, Spirit- why do you all /let/ him push you around? Why not just take the source and game, set it up with a new server host, and update the game with your vision? Why do you HAVE to listen to Raz?
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I do have to wonder... if the staff are as frustrated with Raz's position as xSpirit implies, why have you guys not just... taken over FH by now? You have the source, you could all withdraw and go make your own server with it if you really wanted to, and legally, Raz would have literally 0 power to stop you or do anything about it as he is not the legal copyright holder of the FH source.
So if Raz is THIS overbearing, and this uncaring, as you say, Spirit- why do you all /let/ him push you around? Why not just take the source and game, set it up with a new server host, and update the game with your vision? Why do you HAVE to listen to Raz?
From my experience as a Moderator around when xSpirit had joined and we'd used the source code, Staff do not (or did not) have any access whatsoever. Completed projects/updates were implemented by either Raz or Spirit, I believe, the rest of us just put the work into making sure it was functioning, etc.
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I think this thread is becoming too negative.
This thread was negative at the start
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Listen to the devs, people who worked alongside him. Those who are standing up for Raz without knowing him are just boot lickers, you’re not going to be a mod anytime soon so don’t waste your time
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Listen to the devs, people who worked alongside him. Those who are standing up for Raz without knowing him are just boot lickers, you’re not going to be a mod anytime soon so don’t waste your time
Actually, there are quite a few who do like Raz ~ Devs/Staff included. I do believe that also judging negatively without knowing him is also not quite a good thing either. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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I came back with a sliver of hope that the game could potentially improve; experience from the few months I have been here - from my perspective, the community is a tenth the size it used to be and those who are left are increasingly distant from each other; there are other qualms I have with the current state of things, but they are aside the point - and looking over a few threads have extinguished that. Color me disappointed and not at all surprised (I didn't come back particularly optimistic in the first place).
If I could give an estimate to how long I expect the game to last from here, I'm expecting the the average number of users online to go into single digits into November - whether or not this would be accompanied by the game shutting down, this would translate to FeralHeart's death in my book. Optimistically, I'll give it until the game's tenth anniversary.
Maybe I'm biased as a jaded 2012-2013 player, I don't know.
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FH is dead, anyhow... "a festering corpse of a fallen beast with no hope of resurrection".
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There definitely needs to be a change in the way things are handled. Raz is of course human just like every one of us, so for all we know things on his end could be so hectic to the point where he can't dedicate time to sit at home and deal with what needs to be done with FeralHeart the way they really should be dealt with. He has a life and other responsibilities to deal with, just as we all do. Not everyone can stay at a computer and sit with an animal-based roleplaying game all their life and magically have their personal lives be merry and work in tandem with their time spent with FeralHeart. But of course we don't fully know what's going on for him.
In the past and even in recent times, Raz has always intervened when things got too messy, just as Sura said in her post back on the first page of this thread. For me I feel he does still care, because if he truly didn't, why would he still have FeralHeart running in it's current state? Of course everyone's free to feel what they want, and again we all don't know what's truly going on in that head of his.
I agree with Sura on her words of;
I don’t think it’s as much of an issue about Raz needing to be around to provide the staff/devs with guidance. We don’t need guidance, what we need is perhaps more trust and liberty to do the things we see fit when and how we want to. Staff & devs aren’t blind without Raz’s guidance, in fact if we didn’t need to rely so much on his approval for things there wouldn’t be a need for guidance. The guidance issue only becomes a thing when Raz sets up projects that he wants done if he doesn’t tell us exactly how HE wants HIS projects done.
Along with the rest of what was said in her post.
All in all, personally I'm just glad FeralHeart is still here. This place is very dear to just about everyone who sets foot in this place, even if they're not here with us anymore and have moved on with their lives. I still hold out hope for this small little game.
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I definitely don't believe FH will ever die soon. I don't even believe it will grow even bigger than it was, either. Just like many games, it's popular for the first few years but dies out. I don't think it's the update, personally. Yes, we all miss those sweet ol' maps..But, I don't think that's the problem. It's just change, that's what I believe. A lot of members back then are now grown up and have lives. New people are arriving not knowing what it was like back then. Nobody ever really comes on anymore. Nobody really goes to all the maps. It's not the same as it was. On the other note, I do think discord has also taken over a bit. Discord has allowed many members to roleplay in the app rather than FH itself. I think it's incredible but also saddening to see these beautiful roleplays take place inside of a chatroom(Don't know what to call it). Feralheart is a beautiful game and will continue to move on but it won't become bigger than it was. It will just keep going, and changing. Good or bad.
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This will be the last thing then I'll hang up my hat.
Yes, perhaps this didn’t start with the best intentions going in. But I really sincerely hope things can still remain moderate and we don’t stoop to a lower level.
But it is without saying, the elephant in the room couldn't go under-addressed any longer. I agree with AlphaEclipse in saying that Feral Heart is stuck in 2012 and what I worry for is the inability to adapt to the changing times. This isn't at all toward Staff because I know they're trying hard and they stick around for the community sake. They want change and they do in fact care about the community's opinion of things. It's a matter of they can't act on it because they aren't trusted enough to be able to take that initiative. If it were up to them, things would be different. And I’m really not trying to point fingers and say “Raz Bad”, because it’s a lot deeper than that. But I think the responses in this thread have summed it up very well.
And I have a feeling that no matter how sensibly I try and sound it out, it will be misinterpreted as “Opinion Bad = Person Bad” rhetoric.
But in the bigger picture, it isn't 2012 anymore. Things have vastly changed since then, and while I've tried to keep an optimist mindset and reserve hope for Feral Heart's future, it's so hard to keep up when the reality of the situation is glaring at you in the face. And I know I'm certainly not alone in thinking this and having concern for the direction things could be steered in.
While yes there's people registering on the daily, how long do they stick around?
I’d argue that the main population on Feral Heart are basically old players. I don’t see a lot of new people hanging around for a long time, on the forum here too. There are different reasons, FH perhaps hasn’t aged as well as other games, the big community blowouts drive people away, people may appear too cliquey and not-so inclusive of new players, there isn’t much going on in-game these days which creates lack of interest and just generally a big generational divide between old players and new players. This is a myriad of reasons for people not sticking around. It depends on person to person, but these are the common ones I’ve heard.
While it’s okay if you’re already fine with how things are, that’s fine too, I don’t want to change your mind but at least consider where some of these concerns from other players are coming from. Brushing them off as just ‘negativity’ only does so much. I’m happy some here have at least considered it, even if they don’t inherently agree. Your consideration is at least some effort to try and understand and I appreciate it greatly.
I may be wrong, Feral Heart may have a chance or it may not. I can't know that for sure.
But, consider at least that the community is in a place of confusion and wait.
I can’t say if and when FH will shut down. I don’t know what the future holds and anything is bound to happen. These are just my thoughts and opinions on the matter.
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raz is a questionable leader.
but the servers are all still up.
all of the staff i feel have things they should be more honest about and there are some i believe should resign.
but they still do their taxing job for no pay.
both the team and admin deserve scrutiny. comes with the job.
but that comes at the price of us responding as responsible playerbase who are willing to not just start screaming and belittling actions done that we have no context to.
it's not black and white. but i can't say that because it still makes me a bootlicker, ig.
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I haven't been on here in a long while, but I think I should put in two cents worth to this conversation, because it can be very sour or very positive depending on how you look at it.
I've always been a firm believer that Raz does as he wants because he thinks it could benefit things long-term. However, some projects, ideas, and other things he can be very tired of very fast, and I do assume he loses interest over time. While I could only assume that Feral Heart is one of them, I also like to think he's always thought about ways to improve the game for the betterment of the game. The reason I know this, is because I, like Scally, Sura, etc, worked alongside him and heard his ideas.
His methods are questionable, but a lot of hesitation and the way he does things comes from a lack of trust. Raz lacks a firm trust in anyone, which is why I think a lot of the time staff are required to run things by him in hopes of accomplishing things. While this can be good to make sure the game is going in a good direction, it can also affect staff performance and overall community interaction. Raz has never been a bad dude, he's human like the rest of us. He just lacks trust, which isn't exactly excusable for being negligent, but it is an understandable thing if he hesitates. I do hope that in some time soon, things get fixed.
Just be thankful for what you have right now, because honestly? We all could've lost this game a few months back. You don't have to praise anyone, but be appreciative for what you have right now and don't jump the gun to come to poor conclusions. Who knows? Maybe things will change for the better. Being negative doesn't always have it's benefits.
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i've been seeing a lot of "being in that position is hard!" being thrown around and it's makes me, hmmm.
part of administrating a game, and having a team along with it, is communication. if that's too hard... idk man.
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i've been seeing a lot of "being in that position is hard!" being thrown around and it's makes me, hmmm.
part of administrating a game, and having a team along with it, is communication. if that's too hard... idk man.
this. this is absolutely understandable and theres really no way to say it's hard because that's the job that was taken on.
I can understand it being hard but if it's taking a toll I would expect something in some way to be done rather than just letting the game go on its own. I'm sure everyone is lucky the server is even still up but goodness, at least some communication can be brought out. But I guess not, unfortunately.
You're exactly right.
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I do have to wonder... if the staff are as frustrated with Raz's position as xSpirit implies, why have you guys not just... taken over FH by now? You have the source, you could all withdraw and go make your own server with it if you really wanted to, and legally, Raz would have literally 0 power to stop you or do anything about it as he is not the legal copyright holder of the FH source.
So if Raz is THIS overbearing, and this uncaring, as you say, Spirit- why do you all /let/ him push you around? Why not just take the source and game, set it up with a new server host, and update the game with your vision? Why do you HAVE to listen to Raz?
From my experience as a Moderator around when xSpirit had joined and we'd used the source code, Staff do not (or did not) have any access whatsoever. Completed projects/updates were implemented by either Raz or Spirit, I believe, the rest of us just put the work into making sure it was functioning, etc.
Spirit does, though, and they seem pretty frustrated with Raz... I just don't understand why they wouldn't just take the code and leave to move FH's updates somewhere else if Raz's actions behind the scenes are that bad. FH is not Raz. Raz is not FH, they could have FH without Raz- they don't HAVE to choose between letting FH die or letting Raz continue to push them around and treat them badly. Hell- Raz isn't even the only one who has the source that could provide the staff with it.
I don't want to see FH die, and I'm sure the staff don't either- but there IS an option, if they wanted to take it. Raz is not the owner of FH, or even the heart of it- he keeps the servers up and that's... it. It would be entirely possible for the staff to withdraw and set up with a new, separate server with a new server host, and actually have the freedom to implement the updates they want- preventing the game's eventual death.
If the choice is between "take the source and run with it" or "let FH just die", I'd take "take the source and run"....
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"This thread is bad & you should feel bad"
i often think i'm alone in thinking Raz is a good server host. Almost no downtime.
He doesn't seem that involved with the staff, but if they had a clearer idea of what was given the ok, that'd be fine. From what i can observe.
Consider the concept of "the great filter", in the fermi paradox. with all the stars & planets out there, you'd think there'd be more signs of extra-terrestrial life.
Now leaving ones home planet, let alone set up colonies elsewhere requires exponential amounts of effort.
In a world where computers have changed, peoples pass-times have changed a bit, but to measure up to a new world, FH only needed to evolve a bit.
Now that's where the comparison sort of starts, we're at the great filter stage, just a bit more (concerted?) effort to push it to the 'snowballing colony effect' & FH makes it to the stars to live life eternal.
Or without that last great push, it stays on it's planet until it's sun burns out.
Just need to get off the 'backfoot'.
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in regards to the theoretical "staff taking over the game" thing, if such a situation did come to pass, who would pay to constantly be running everything and keep it going smoothly?
some staff member? would a patreon be launched? like idk if you believe the game is dying how many people would support it until a new update draws in more people?
and who would be chosen? who has the technical wherewithall to run a game, even tho, granted, fh is relatively small?
hate to be a downer since there's already so many drudgeries and doomers here on this thread already but i just don't know if that's the smartest idea to be putting in people's heads at the present time, no matter how good the intent behind it is.
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in regards to the theoretical "staff taking over the game" thing, if such a situation did come to pass, who would pay to constantly be running everything and keep it going smoothly?
some staff member? would a patreon be launched? like idk if you believe the game is dying how many people would support it until a new update draws in more people?
and who would be chosen? who has the technical wherewithall to run a game, even tho, granted, fh is relatively small?
hate to be a downer since there's already so many drudgeries and doomers here on this thread already but i just don't know if that's the smartest idea to be putting in people's heads at the present time, no matter how good the intent behind it is.
I gotta agree to this, honestly. I see my last post was somewhat mocked and trust me - I don't care about that. But people make it seem like something TLK-esque would happen on FH if Razmirz stepped down or they took the surce code - A 'good'/better server host would show up, and FH would automatically gain it's player base back. Using their own logic against them though; if FH is currently as bad as they claim it to be, it would take at least a bunch of months for that to happen, IF it at all did, albeit with Razmirz or not. Remember, Razmirz himself said he thought about retiring if there were any other people within the staff that wished/knew how to work on the server. Honestly, I'm surprised no paywalls were added to FH at this point - Most online games we find out there have those, which is why this game is possibly a sanctuary to many 'casual' people. Again agreeing to the quoted post, I've rarely saw FeralHeart's server down while Razmirz did it's maintenance.
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I know at least 2 server hosters only from the top of my head who would be willing to host FH if needed.
I also know a few people who are very experienced in running a game, and even 1-2 game design students who would be willing to contribute to FH.
How to pay for a server? Ads. Just like FH does currently. But if you are smart, you can find literally a ton of ways to monetize a game.
A few months of work? What if I told you that FH already has a ton of content done, just sitting around, technically ready to be launched, but we couldn't when we wanted to since one man wasn't around to look at our progress.. And now we just simply don't really want to wait for maybe even a year or more to publish everything so we put everything Raz related aside? Would it really take months to add and improve the game by a ton, if we already worked for at least 4 or 5 months on it?
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That wasn't the point I was trying to make, though. I'm sure FH may have a lot of content pending approval, but I'm talking about player activity rather than work time here. Even if someone else takes over, it might still be a while before we'd get a steady amount of players, that is if people decide to give FH a chance. Back in 2012-2013, when many say the game was the most active it came to be, there were a lot of people registering in the span of 2-3 years after it's release. Since Feralheart is an independent game not currently in a platform like Steam, it would take time to get more people to join, let alone get them interested.
As for the monetization, I'm not sure if it would work at least at first. I can understand the ads part, but considering the player base as it is now, finding ways to monetize FH would probably just get more players to leave. As was said earlier, one of the things that kept FH alive thus far is the nostalgia factor, and really if something as little as the removal of General affected the game's activity, I really don't know if adding payments to the game would be a good idea. Sure, maybe some 'optional' things like commissioning presets into the game's sync like a few IT servers do (should the sync be updated), but maybe a payment to a specific, important part of the gameplay wouldn't be a good idea.
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As for the monetization, I'm not sure if it would work at least at first. I can understand the ads part, but considering the player base as it is now, finding ways to monetize FH would probably just get more players to leave. As was said earlier, one of the things that kept FH alive thus far is the nostalgia factor, and really if something as little as the removal of General affected the game's activity, I really don't know if adding payments to the game would be a good idea. Sure, maybe some 'optional' things like commissioning presets into the game's sync like a few IT servers do (should the sync be updated), but maybe a payment to a specific, important part of the gameplay wouldn't be a good idea.
I don't think he's so much as referring to make FH a 'pay-to-play' game if that's what your referring to. Ad revenue is one way to gain a lot of monetization to keep the server running, but there are other ways that don't require you to pull out your wallet to pay for it. Even so, there's the optional fundraising pool that you don't have to contribute to, but is simply there for people who do want to help out. And also consider that over the span of FH's lifespan there has been hundreds upon hundreds people who have offered to donate money to support the game they love, if there was one, I'd be most certain people would drop at least $5. In fact. Once upon a time there was a donation pool for FH, early in the day, but Raz shut it down. I don't know the reasons in full, but, he simply didn't want people donating.
Personally, I don't think it's such a terrible thing to have as such.
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i don't doubt there are some players willing to donate if fh was taken off into the hills for a fresh start [i was approaching the idea in the shoes of someone who believes the game is dying/dead since no one else seemed to want to address the first post made about $],
or that there are people who would be willing to take the burden of running the game.
i do have to question the people who'd be the new head admin though - i won't ask names as this isn't the place to put people on the spot [there's enough of that happening already lol] but do they understand what fh needs? what the game is and what the community wants? are they long time players or outsiders who just happen to have spare time to run a furry roleplaying game?
i know that some of these things aren't exactly strong suits of raz's, but as ready as some people are to get rid of him, it makes me wonder if they'll just vote anyone else into the chair just to be rid of him with no questions asked..?
i had to express concern about both monetization and leadership because i think that now, especially with the release of this thread and things that mods, players and ex-staff have said, if raz ever comes back and sees this, that'll be it. he for sure won't trust anyone with the game, no matter how logical we may try and spin it. the source code will remain his and his alone 'til the end of time.
once it's said and out there, it can never be taken back.
personally i'm just trying to look at our current state as neutrally as i can. there's errors to be made in thinking too optimistically and being let down and being too negative and trying to get other people to be as miserable as you are about your hopelessness.
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the source code will remain his and his alone 'til the end of time.
once it's said and out there, it can never be taken back.
The source code, and in fact the game is owned by KovuLKD. Not Razmirz. The server might be his, but the game is not.
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once again you're right, error in words on my part.
i more meant that raz is/was the only person around[ish.. he does still talk to a few people if this thread is anything to go off of] who theoretically could/would, since kovu's been gone since long before i started playing.
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the source code will remain his and his alone 'til the end of time.
once it's said and out there, it can never be taken back.
The source code, and in fact the game is owned by KovuLKD. Not Razmirz. The server might be his, but the game is not.
I honestly think you and the FH staff should actually do exactly what I just suggested earlier in the thread. From the sounds of it, Raz is just contributing to the death of the game by refusing to allow you all to actually apply any updates without his approval. Leave, take the source code with you, and start up an entirely new, updated FH server away from Raz.
Raz would have literally 0 power whatsoever to do anything about it, legally. No one wants to see FH die and at this point it sounds like you all leaving to make a new server away from Raz's grip of control is the only possible way to actually save it.
And if you DID, there are plenty of people who would be willing to join in and help out with progress on the game's development, and helping your version of it to be successful in bringing the community over to it.
The 'server host' should not be the absolute head of power, tbh.
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I do have to agree with Skullfrost.
FeralHeart has been taken care of by Razmirz for many years, I can see why he's not one to trust just anyone when comes the thought of retirement. When you've got such a large amount of data regarding accounts (which can involve personal information i.e email addresses, birthdays, passwords I believe), there will be an extremely high standard that a special someone must meet if they are to be trusted to be transferred all that information. The last thing Raz would need would be to hand over it all, only to find out a month or so later, that person couldn't and can't be trusted - that blame would go to him (knowing what people are like) because it would have been 'Raz's decision to pass the server to them.'
However, despite his protective ways, there does come the issue we are currently in.
With Razmirz MIA, updates are at an all-time halt. An all too familiar problem we had for years before xSpirit came along, really.
This stressed out his Staff team, which alleviates to the community getting stressed out; as I heard, there were sneak peeks/teasers of what's to come, but right now that seems impossible, which is why people are getting frustrated and 'lashing out'. Feral Heart has gone back to a stage that we were all led to believe wouldn't have to be experienced anymore, we thought the ball was finally going to get rolling. For a while, it did! I imagine the Staff had lots 'n' lots going on, getting it all ready. They've now reached the stage where they may be ready to release some stuff, but they can't. While xSpirit came along with the source code, Raz is the one who manages it all for proper release. So even though xSpirit is or was this game's 'Code Breaker', Spirit can't do anything without Raz's input.
While it's all good to have someone as an overall leader of a team, that leader is most responsible for keeping things running... sadly, the only thing that's being kept running is the game in terms of being able to actually play. What Raz hasn't been able to run as smoothly as I'd like to think he wishes, which again provokes frustration through everyone else.
It's all, really, going back and forth. A long, neverending bumpy road.
Which is why I agree with Skullfrost's point.
For so many years, while we appreciate everything Razmirz has done for us, I don't think it can truly continue like this.
I don't think we can hold on for much longer, without second guessing just how far we can get running on this bumpy road, with only hopes and dreams with the occasional, very occasional, success.
As we all know, FH is already dying, practically dead at some times during the day. No one has the motivation to want to get online 24/7 anymore. Heck, even Staff don't always want to get on (I understand we all get busy, but let's be honest, FH gives no one the excited feeling of getting on every day to constantly discover something new, update or not).
While this is our home, it can still be our home if we move on.
Starting up a new server that can be updated consistently (with or without Raz's input/help/presence) could be what revives this game and bring back all that nostalgia, or spark an entirely new one.
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I stand by the opinion that raz should be booted by staff, if he won’t leave I believe he should be pushed out.
Yes there are a few issues and kinks that would have to be worked out, but it will be better for the game in the long run.
Yes I’m suggesting a bit of temporary anarchy on the staffs part.
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Yes I’m suggesting a bit of temporary anarchy on the staffs part.
the staff did that before (kind of)
uhh i didn't really end well
there's truly nothing you guys can do about feralheart itself except play the waiting game.
i wholeheartedly agree with skullfrost on this one too.
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If that is this case, why must this discussion be had, furthermore keep being had?
There is obvious concern that has been lingering for years, which means people have solutions that should be considered. Simply giving up, and playing this waiting game, won't grant anyone any favours from all ends of the spectrum. Patience may be a virtue, but that won't come with waiting.
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i'm not so sure myself, but best guess is because this problem has been going on for too long. there's obviously a rather niche community wanting to play this game but so many things are setting it back. me and many other people want to see something better, but in the current situation there's really nothing to hope for.
at this point the community can't really do anything unless they move on to another thing. or, stick around and hope for the best. this is not just me being negative.
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There is a lot of truth in what's being said.
The totality of the situation is that this thing has been a battle that just simply can't be won over. Staff have tried to make things their way, but the incident in October of 2018 happened as a result, and sure while they came back as staff, they aren't trusted enough to have liberty some decisions like updates and things to bring toward the player-base. And I can assume if we push any harder to take control, the game might just be shut down in a fit of anger. And as stated, this server still belongs to Raz. He may not own FH, but he does own the server. It's not the most just thing to do, it would only further provoke him.
Unfortunately, there just isn't much we can do. We can only speak up and find a common ground among ourselves. We all love FeralHeart, to some this is our home. FeralHeart has given me the best years of my life and taught me so much, which you don't think you would be able to get much out of a TLK inspired sparkle dog hell, but turns out, there is layers upon layers of life lessons. I don't regret a moment of being here and I think just being a MOTS this last season solidified my love for this game.
All I can say is to keep speaking up and I implore you to just hold out for as long as you can take it.
Our voices may be rendered powerless right now and it may seem like a losing battle, but, we'll see what the future may hold.
This isn't over yet.
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anarchy is doomed to fail if you don't know what you're up against and running as a mob with pitchforks and torches towards an unknown enemy, if 2018-related events are anything to go off of.
a fh with a new host, no changes made beyond that aside from, say, quality of life+character creation oriented updates would be something i would totally incline myself to play if the opportunity presented itself.
if people run off with the source code and just make another generic ITesque server, i'll stay behind. i've already stated how i feel about fh and its modification system elsewhere and i'll stand with it.
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anarchy is doomed to fail if you don't know what you're up against and running as a mob with pitchforks and torches towards an unknown enemy, if 2018-related events are anything to go off of.
a fh with a new host, no changes made beyond that aside from, say, quality of life+character creation oriented updates would be something i would totally incline myself to play if the opportunity presented itself.
if people run off with the source code and just make another generic ITesque server, i'll stay behind. i've already stated how i feel about fh and its modification system elsewhere and i'll stand with it.
You're misunderstanding what I'm saying. If the entire staff and xSpirit left with the source code and started a new FH server, it literally WOULD just be FH with a new server host and new updates. All they'd be doing is literally getting a new server host and moving websites, as they'd be unable to use this one due to Razmirz owning it.
It would not at all be the same as FH just turning into a generic IT server type thing- because it'd be run by the official FH staff, and for all intents and purposes, it WOULD literally just be FH under new leadership. Doing that is literally the only way to kick Raz out and replace him with a new server host- by /leaving/ and taking the game with them. They can't kick Raz off his own server, or his own site, but they CAN take the game from him and move somewhere else. That is a thing they could do.
It'd literally just be a case of taking FH, and shoving it somewhere else, under new management. Very few would stick around here if that happened and would happily move over there and accept it as the 'new FH.'
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anarchy is doomed to fail if you don't know what you're up against and running as a mob with pitchforks and torches towards an unknown enemy, if 2018-related events are anything to go off of.
a fh with a new host, no changes made beyond that aside from, say, quality of life+character creation oriented updates would be something i would totally incline myself to play if the opportunity presented itself.
if people run off with the source code and just make another generic ITesque server, i'll stay behind. i've already stated how i feel about fh and its modification system elsewhere and i'll stand with it.
You're misunderstanding what I'm saying. If the entire staff and xSpirit left with the source code and started a new FH server, it literally WOULD just be FH with a new server host and new updates. All they'd be doing is literally getting a new server host and moving websites, as they'd be unable to use this one due to Razmirz owning it.
It would not at all be the same as FH just turning into a generic IT server type thing- because it'd be run by the official FH staff, and for all intents and purposes, it WOULD literally just be FH under new leadership. Doing that is literally the only way to kick Raz out and replace him with a new server host- by /leaving/ and taking the game with them. They can't kick Raz off his own server, or his own site, but they CAN take the game from him and move somewhere else. That is a thing they could do.
It'd literally just be a case of taking FH, and shoving it somewhere else, under new management. Very few would stick around here if that happened and would happily move over there and accept it as the 'new FH.'
hence the "a fh with a new host, no changes made beyond that aside from, say, quality of life+character creation oriented updates would be something i would totally incline myself to play if the opportunity presented itself."
i'm okay with fh being fh, but i've also seen people advocate for the game going in the direction of it being just another IT server, even before we knew we had the source code.
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In all honesty I believe FH has had its prime, and its just barely holding on thanks to this community.
Do I want it to eventually die? Nah, Don't think so.
Will it though?
We do not know for sure. When it probably does FULLY wane out, most of us probably wouldn't be as interested as we are now. Me on the other hand? I will maybe stick around til then, who knows.
I have refrained from being pessimistic but in all honesty what happens, happens. As sad as it may seem, there is not much we can do other than keep up what we're doing.
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Ever since I saw this thread I've had a lot of thoughts. Most of them, as I look around FeralHeart in it's current state, are thoughts consisting of me being incredibly anxious for change.
In all the time I've played this game, there has barely been any change aside of community, and maps, a change sprung on us pretty quickly. It was only recently the source code was obtained after all this time and put to good use, with the changes to the character creation. But even before so, the community has been fading out. Especially when the maps were changed, of which I still grieve as a returning member, the familiarity is gone. Attempts may have been made to replicate the old maps, and some maps were named like the previous, but even then my point stands; the familiarity is gone. Without set points in maps to flock to, with community members leaving and others following, Feralheart has been waning out for a while.
What I'm trying to say, is change is essential to the flow of time, to the fate of this game, but it could easily become its demise as well as far as we've seen. It really depends on what kind of change it is and how it impacts the community, and I don't think I agree with the maps being the first thing to change considering how impactful it was and the lack of familiarity it gave to the game, but that's just my opinion. However, there are many things that do need to be changed. Customization options, running animation, map variety, bug fixes (like the one I encountered), etc. And the slower these changes are now, the more Feralheart will be caught by the tide and pushed under. I understand these things take time, and I'm not referring to that, I'm referring to the time it takes to communicate about these changes, to begin to work on these changes, to get the approval for these changes. And if all of that takes months to a year to do, with there being no advertising for the game, then Feralheart will lag behind, no doubt, as it already has.
That being said, the remaining community it has, many who are active now are old and returning members who want to see it out to the end. In that, the game will live on, and even if it continues as it is now, I'm sure it'll live for a long time, albeit with much fewer members than before. I don't see Feralheart dying out too quick, but I really think it would greatly benefit from some more work done on it. I have nothing against Raz, nor am I suggesting anything of anyone's position, but I don't think the game could work out like this forever. It may last for a long while, but it seems more like an ill animal now rather than its once thriving self.
I'm rambling, so I'm gonna stop there. Those are just some thoughts I'm having out loud about the game.
On the end note, though, I agree with KD on this line: "I have refrained from being pessimistic but in all honesty what happens, happens. As sad as it may seem, there is not much we can do other than keep up what we're doing."