Feral Heart
Game & Forum Discussion => Game Discussion => Game Suggestions & Ideas => Topic started by: Calvary on June 12, 2020, 06:16:45 pm
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This is mostly a staff-related suggestion that has impact on the game’s future, but I wanted to suggest this because I know how hard and difficult it is to get anything done while waiting for an answer. I have no doubts that many things are on hold or may not even be escalating due to waiting for confirmation from our Server Master. So here might be a suggestion I hope you consider.
As we know, a lot of the projects have to get passed through Razmirz in order to escalate or be continued. A lot of the times, he is quite busy and these projects can be swept under the rug for weeks, or literally months, if they even get touched upon at all.
Why not have a balanced system on the team? Community suggests or proposals, or even things the community votes on, should be brought up by MOTS and Staff as a proposal. Write a written statement, a “pitch” as I like to call it. What’s the reason for the project? What’s the objective? What is the project about and why is it important? What will need to be done for this project to be completed?
This proposal is checked by a third party or mutual party (perhaps MOTS?), assuring the project is notable, within proper reason, and can be doable by whatever standards. If the third party denies it, or asks for revisions, make sure the revisions are properly attributed or carry on with another project. If the proposal is accepted, then the project may carry on.
Razmirz is allowed to veto a proposal even after all parties agreed, but his veto must be within reason. Under certain guidelines or strict and proper reason should a project be vetoed even after these parties have agreed to it. If the veto is right and just, the project will be cancelled, or revised further according to what the veto was for.
The community could even collaboratively make the requirements on why a project can be vetoed, etc.
Any revisions asked to be made, the third party should specify the problems located in the proposal and address them to the team. Any revisions based upon the veto should be addressed by Razmirz himself.
This is simply a suggestion, but I feel maybe decisions or projects may move along much more efficiently this way rather than the current system. Please feel free to suggest adjustments or anything of the sort.
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This is mostly a staff-related suggestion that has impact on the game’s future, but I wanted to suggest this because I know how hard and difficult it is to get anything done while waiting for an answer. I have no doubts that many things are on hold or may not even be escalating due to waiting for confirmation from our Server Master. So here might be a suggestion I hope you consider.
As we know, a lot of the projects have to get passed through Razmirz in order to escalate or be continued. A lot of the times, he is quite busy and these projects can be swept under the rug for weeks, or literally months, if they even get touched upon at all.
Why not have a balanced system on the team? Community suggests or proposals, or even things the community votes on, should be brought up by MOTS and Staff as a proposal. Write a written statement, a “pitch” as I like to call it. What’s the reason for the project? What’s the objective? What is the project about and why is it important? What will need to be done for this project to be completed?
This proposal is checked by a third party or mutual party (perhaps MOTS?), assuring the project is notable, within proper reason, and can be doable by whatever standards. If the third party denies it, or asks for revisions, make sure the revisions are properly attributed or carry on with another project. If the proposal is accepted, then the project may carry on.
Razmirz is allowed to veto a proposal even after all parties agreed, but his veto must be within reason. Under certain guidelines or strict and proper reason should a project be vetoed even after these parties have agreed to it. If the veto is right and just, the project will be cancelled, or revised further according to what the veto was for.
The community could even collaboratively make the requirements on why a project can be vetoed, etc.
Any revisions asked to be made, the third party should specify the problems located in the proposal and address them to the team. Any revisions based upon the veto should be addressed by Razmirz himself.
This is simply a suggestion, but I feel maybe decisions or projects may move along much more efficiently this way rather than the current system. Please feel free to suggest adjustments or anything of the sort.
Interesting proposal Cal. I had no idea you were into this kind of thing. :)
But like all plans, there would need to be details worked out like:
* who should be a member of each so called group?
* what should be considered "within reason"?
* what sort of interactions should take place between said groups?
Stuff like that would need to be addressed.
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@ dylan,
True, though that's really true with any suggestion towards staff, there is always a reason/reasons to not do something or logistics to be mulled over. The first step is taking to an idea. Calvary/other members can't detail each little point on a roadmap, at some point common sense has to come into play.
Anyways, I think it would be a nice system if pitches and ideas were passed through multiple people and even the community more! And if things were more like, openly discussed in community improving proposals, if an idea isn't favored, there could be more details on what needs to be done in order for everyone to be comfortable.
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wasn't there something a while ago where there was this shadow team supposed to make sure staff stayed in line
and then it didn't work
not dissing the suggestion, i like it
i'm just trying to make sure i'm remembering that right
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I think it's good idea. Discussions about projects and plans would be really good. As Leda said, it would be nice to sometimes discuiss about patches, actualizations, etc.
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Sorry for the slow reply everyone! Thank you for the feedback.
I suppose “within reason” would mean anything that could impact the game in a negative way. No excuse of “just because I don’t want it” isn’t a valid excuse. Perhaps the project could possibly impact other essences of the game in a negative way, maybe it will cause too many problems in the long run. Maybe it’s a project the game itself cannot handle without tons of lag. There can be a variety of reasons!
Perhaps the MOTS can serve as a third party and would be that “group” that helps accept or deny proposals. We vote them in to speak for the community, right? I would expect them to hold that same attitude when looking over project proposals.
But to @leda, you are exactly right! I do think most ideas or proposals should be passed to the community. Perhaps the community could even serve as that “3rd party” or MOTS. Whatever the case, all ideas should really be passed to the community for speculation. I would hope that third parties would ask for revisions when it came to passing around the proposal for acceptance.
As for shadow staff I honestly have no clue, but I would hope this would work with the community having a voice and power to check. None of this has a balance currently. I would hope this could be some sort of solution.
Thank you guys for the feedback, I’d love more if possible <3
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I love this myself personally. It may def get more stuff done for sure....maybe.
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Red tape only slows things down that much more.
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Red tape only slows things down that much more.
Explain? I don’t get what you are saying.
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Red tape only slows things down that much more.
Explain? I don’t get what you are saying.
I believe what Vortex is trying to say, is that the more debates and voting that have to take place the longer it will take to come to an agreement. Which would mean more waiting for the community to get change.
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It’s appreciated that you took the time to think out this idea, write it, and present it to us Cal. The only issue here is that this just isn’t how Raz works. If it was just staff, community, and MOTS discussing things to come to a decision it would get done without the need for all this process just to push out to Raz. With the current system this would just make the process even longer, all for Raz to likely just deny whatever we set up. We’ve done this before with things like polls, petitions, and contracts and it’s just not how he works. You can see how things like the mass bring back the old maps or general chat stuff goes, and that’s a desire directly expressed by the community.
While it’s Raz’s server all final say on to what gets implemented and put in is up to him: if he wants it, how he wants it, and when he wants or is able to put it in. We can all go about taking time with this suggestion of yours only to finally present it to him and to simply get the same response we always get just with more steps in between. Ideally all we staff would need is the community to say what they want, staff then to discuss it and get to work while giving them constant updates so they can check in along the process with us. In a simpler world this is how we’d like it to work. What keeps certain things from happening isn’t the process of how staff is doing it or what they want but it’s because it comes back down to Raz after it’s gone through all of us. We’ve directly linked him threads and things the community has asked for but again it’s down to his response and desire to make those changes to his server if it happens or not. The way the requests are presented or formatted mean nothing if it’s just not something he wants or thinks is best.
There’s nothing inherently wrong with your idea or suggestion, I think it’s well organized and makes sense but not for this situation. I’m sorry <3 We really do appreciate you trying to assist us in coming up with a workable solution though.
It just kind of comes back to things I’ve said before. Raz has a vision of what he wants us (community & staff) to do with the game (whether he expresses that as clearly as we like or not). Even when he suggests that he wants to be the background man he still has a heavy influence and final decision over things, otherwise staff would have already fixed and implemented the things you’ve asked for by now. It’s not in our control. We are simply working for him and his server. Because this is his server after a while staff & community will have to accept that we have to respect the way he does or wants things done even if we don’t agree with them. If we want anything to be done we just have to work with Raz how he works. This doesn’t mean that there will not be updates but what it does mean is that it may not be as soon as you want them, how you want them always, or as transparent of a process. If Raz wants us to do it his way it’s what we have to do to be able to get anything done for you.
I can’t stress enough to you all that we do value your input though and we don’t want you to feel discouraged, it can be just as frustrating for us sometimes.
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Red tape only slows things down that much more.
I'd appreciate a much less 'cryptic' response, thank you kindly.
It’s appreciated that you took the time to think out this idea, write it, and present it to us Cal. The only issue here is that this just isn’t how Raz works. If it was just staff, community, and MOTS discussing things to come to a decision it would get done without the need for all this process just to push out to Raz. With the current system this would just make the process even longer, all for Raz to likely just deny whatever we set up. We’ve done this before with things like polls, petitions, and contracts and it’s just not how he works. You can see how things like the mass bring back the old maps or general chat stuff goes, and that’s a desire directly expressed by the community.
While it’s Raz’s server all final say on to what gets implemented and put in is up to him: if he wants it, how he wants it, and when he wants or is able to put it in. We can all go about taking time with this suggestion of yours only to finally present it to him and to simply get the same response we always get just with more steps in between. Ideally all we staff would need is the community to say what they want, staff then to discuss it and get to work while giving them constant updates so they can check in along the process with us. In a simpler world this is how we’d like it to work. What keeps certain things from happening isn’t the process of how staff is doing it or what they want but it’s because it comes back down to Raz after it’s gone through all of us. We’ve directly linked him threads and things the community has asked for but again it’s down to his response and desire to make those changes to his server if it happens or not. The way the requests are presented or formatted mean nothing if it’s just not something he wants or thinks is best.
There’s nothing inherently wrong with your idea or suggestion, I think it’s well organized and makes sense but not for this situation. I’m sorry <3 We really do appreciate you trying to assist us in coming up with a workable solution though.
It just kind of comes back to things I’ve said before. Raz has a vision of what he wants us (community & staff) to do with the game (whether he expresses that as clearly as we like or not). Even when he suggests that he wants to be the background man he still has a heavy influence and final decision over things, otherwise staff would have already fixed and implemented the things you’ve asked for by now. It’s not in our control. We are simply working for him and his server. Because this is his server after a while staff & community will have to accept that we have to respect the way he does or wants things done even if we don’t agree with them. If we want anything to be done we just have to work with Raz how he works. This doesn’t mean that there will not be updates but what it does mean is that it may not be as soon as you want them, how you want them always, or as transparent of a process. If Raz wants us to do it his way it’s what we have to do to be able to get anything done for you.
I can’t stress enough to you all that we do value your input though and we don’t want you to feel discouraged, it can be just as frustrating for us sometimes.
I appreciate the response, thank you! I totally understand the dilemma, and I'm sorry that my suggestion may not be suitable for this current situation. I do hope you all can figure out some way to go about this without the needed escalation to Raz. I'm sorry this is the sort of situation that you guys, or in fact, all of us were placed into. I suppose that's the unfortunate part of it. I do note this may be a suggestion that would take a little while, but with the right effectiveness (if this situation wasn't in place), I believe this suggestion would work well.
However, this is probably not the case here as you said, but I appreciate the feedback. I understand what kind of position you're in, and I'm sorry that is the case. I really do hope you find a solution!
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There's nothing cryptic about my response.
Red Tape is just another way of saying excessive/redundant/unnecesarry regulation.
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There's nothing cryptic about my response.
Red Tape is just another way of saying excessive/redundant/unnecessary regulation.
how is being held accountable for what you do a detriment
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What on earth are you even talking about? We are held accountable. If you have an issue with how things are run, take it to Raz. He is the one who has it this way. It's his server.
No excuse of “just because I don’t want it”
Not once have staff ever made such a statement during my time here. This again goes back to Raz, who is known to sometimes not even give an answer.
shadow
Staff again have no control over this, if it exists. This is yet another thing to bring up with RAZ.
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Question,
how can people bring up issues with Raz themselves when sometimes and for some people, he doesn't respond?
Staff should be counted on to relay information to Raz, to and from the community. They already do this, but rather than telling people to do it, you as a Moderator have much more access to him and his private messages than the community does. Raz isn't exactly always open for everyone to message.
You even said it yourself, he is known to sometimes not even give an answer. Moreso the community than the Staff team.
Issues with how things have run have been brought up. Countless times. By now, Staff are more-or-less our only hope of getting through to Raz effectively, aside from the select few people who have direct contact (either from being ex Staff members or from being friends of his, or both).
Staff are typically viewed as the bridge between the Server Master and the community, while the MOTS are now trying to be viewed as the bridge between the Staff and the community. I appreciate the efforts to make it so, so let's carry on with that as it works well for the most part.
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What on earth are you even talking about? We are held accountable. If you have an issue with how things are run, take it to Raz. He is the one who has it this way. It's his server.
No excuse of “just because I don’t want it”
Not once have staff ever made such a statement during my time here. This again goes back to Raz, who is known to sometimes not even give an answer.
shadow
Staff again have no control over this, if it exists. This is yet another thing to bring up with RAZ.
I never said staff made such a statement by the way. I was actually guiding that quote toward Raz, not staff. Just so you’re aware.
If no one can talk to Raz, what’s the point of staying? If this all has to do with him, why do you even stay and burden yourselves like that? It doesn’t help the community this way by staying.
By the way, yes, your response was a bit ‘cryptic’ and I have put quotes around the word because I don’t mean it exactly, but your quote was less about feedback and more about your disdain for the suggestion. This is a suggestion that could work given if these weren’t the circumstances.
If this is a “Raz” problem, I truly don’t understand why you stay. I know you stay out of care, but it’s not really about care anymore if you can’t actually do anything for the community.
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If this is a “Raz” problem, I truly don’t understand why you stay. I know you stay out of care, but it’s not really about care anymore if you can’t actually do anything for the community.
I'll speak on my reasons for this!
It's frustrating having to sit back and watch things happen that you know could have been prevented with more communication or could be better with simple fixes to the game. (Example: the "forbidden" chat that would solve the problem of the map chats seeming quiet and help alleviate the other maps feeling dead. It's a SIMPLE FIX to a huge problem.)
For me, it's holding out the hope that things eventually will change even if it seems bleak and hopeless at times. And it is about care for me because in the meantime, even though there are major problems with the current game, there is still a userbase that plays the current game and needs help. A lot of people turn to the staff to answer questions and provide guidance. I'm constantly getting inbox messages, not just reports but new players needing help installing the game or fixing a crash/bug. That's where I feel the benefit of being on the staff team is even though I don't agree with the way the game is being run.
It's a dilemma. The server is still up, so there still needs to be that staff to help the playerbase when they ask for help. But deeply-rooted issues are not getting solved.
I've debated leaving several times because i'm frustrated and tired but I still have a drive to see things change. I'm not saying you don't because I know you do too! Which was a reason that you stated on why you've still been posting on the forums.
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If this is a “Raz” problem, I truly don’t understand why you stay. I know you stay out of care, but it’s not really about care anymore if you can’t actually do anything for the community.
I'll speak on my reasons for this!
It's frustrating having to sit back and watch things happen that you know could have been prevented with more communication or could be better with simple fixes to the game. (Example: the "forbidden" chat that would solve the problem of the map chats seeming quiet and help alleviate the other maps feeling dead. It's a SIMPLE FIX to a huge problem.)
For me, it's holding out the hope that things eventually will change even if it seems bleak and hopeless at times. And it is about care for me because in the meantime, even though there are major problems with the current game, there is still a userbase that plays the current game and needs help. A lot of people turn to the staff to answer questions and provide guidance. I'm constantly getting inbox messages, not just reports but new players needing help installing the game or fixing a crash/bug. That's where I feel the benefit of being on the staff team is even though I don't agree with the way the game is being run.
It's a dilemma. The server is still up, so there still needs to be that staff to help the playerbase when they ask for help. But deeply-rooted issues are not getting solved.
I've debated leaving several times because i'm frustrated and tired but I still have a drive to see things change. I'm not saying you don't because I know you do too! Which was a reason that you stated on why you've still been posting on the forums.
I completely understand, Morgra, trust me. I don’t doubt you’re frustrated and everything is just a bit difficult. Things that typically have an easy fix just... don’t anymore.
I appreciate you speaking about your own reasons for staying. I know I left a few times in the past simply because it frustrated me too much, but I did love the community regardless and did want to help. I apologize that things cant be done at the moment, but I appreciate that response. <3
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Well I apologize then, it's a fairly common term for me, I am in fact against further adding more things that will simply slow everything down because Raz would still keep a short leash on all of it anyway. I also didn't mean to make any assumptions, but at least that's cleared up.
I am here because I'd rather there still be place for everyone to go. I don't believe shutting things down is a solution to anything. I am here because I can still see possibilities for change, to fix the game up right for everyone to enjoy and I have no intention of leaving/quitting. I'd rather see it to the end and make things happen than just give up.
It doesn't help anything when staff are treated as if they are the ones who did something wrong when all we have been doing is trying to help, even with all the limits imposed on us, whether it's us not getting a reponse or unable to make a change because we don't have access or permission to. We'd absolutely love to share things with everyone and talk about what's going on! But Raz doesn't want this right now.