Feral Heart

Game & Forum Discussion => Game Discussion => Topic started by: Lady_Alizarin on November 14, 2013, 02:56:33 am

Title: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: Lady_Alizarin on November 14, 2013, 02:56:33 am
When roleplaying, is it really important to win all your roleplay battles?

Have you ever noticed some roleplayers in this community find it so important to win every roleplay battle they get into? "I'm the strongest Warrior in the Clan! There's no way I can lose!" Even in some character bios I see some people put things like... Battle Wins: 7 Battle Loses: 0  
And in some roleplay battles, there's always that one character that just seems so undefeatable and pretty much ignores any attacks thrown at him/her. And when you call them a powerplayer for ignoring your attacks, they throw a big fit about it.
  
Is it so important to make your character look so strong and undefeatable in combat? WHY is it so important to win every battle you get into? Is always winning such a big deal?
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: darkknight on November 14, 2013, 03:07:40 am
It's a common thing to wanting to be the perfect fighter and win every battle. Yes, we can look at the scenario in a fantasy point of view, however, even in fantasy, there is imperfection. Not everyone wins, the "hero" doesn't always get the last laugh. If they did, would they be interesting in a whole?

With a character that is spot on with everything, in this case, winning, how are they interesting? What does it say about the character themselves? Yes, we could agree they are strong, but is that it? Winning does not define the character, interaction and progression does. In my opinion, if there is no loses, how can your character grow? In developing a character, it is great to see how they learn and improve themselves in whatever story-line they are put into.
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: Redlinelies on November 14, 2013, 09:12:11 am
If I'm going to be completely honest, I never understood the purpose of plain roleplay text fights in a moving chat.

Unless the one you fight is a close friend that you know will roleplay on the same terms, or that the roleplay fight is already set up with who that's going to win, it just doesn't work well. The chances of bumping into someone level headed plain off in a public roleplay that you never talked to before is just too low. I know that some people really do enjoy their roleplay fights, hence one reason why warrior cats is so popular and we we have things like fight dogs and territory fights in roleplay a lot in general, but I personally really fail to see the point of living off FeralHeart as a winning fighter in roleplays about fighting and battles, even silly, and probably a reason why I've stayed away from it.

I've seen a few users around(not only warrior cats) that has their victories in fights listed in their bio among with how fierce they are and how anyone that meets them in a fight will be demolished. It's great and all that you want to be this big butt character that is cool and all that but it feels like just because you have a bio like this, it makes you the automatic winner of any upcoming fight unless the other user is just as stubborn and has a bio put up the same way. In this case people just want to be better than others or look better, be someone that stands out in the roleplays. It's a bit like the typical thing of Male lions in prides always have to be as big as possible on the sliders in character creation, the majority doesn't want to be the smaller one in the bigger picture, and the same goes for things like warrior cats I believe since it's so focused on fighting and defending territories.

The fighting itself though inside of the game I fail to find much satisfaction in having roleplay fights since there's no good system to it other than what we the users make it out to be when we are having these, and relying on someone that is all about winning will not be an easy task. Just something like a /roll command like there was in Impressive Title would assist a lot so users could roll a dice for their turn to do a roleplay post.

People want to be the biggest and baddest even here.
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: unnbrellas on November 14, 2013, 12:07:46 pm
There isn't much point in it at all. I suppose if the character is just a big brute, if you want to show off that trait.....but you still need to lose a battle every now an and then.
I have 3 characters I rp with, only one of them being semi-undefeated. One of them is just very submissive, another overconfident and stupid. The semi undefeated one isn't really fighting, just tricking her opponent.

Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: Transatlantic on November 14, 2013, 12:47:42 pm
I really don't prefer roleplaying with people who do this. Not only because they probably won't understand the idea of a fair battle ("I'm undefeated! So I /can/ block that hit, but you can't block mine!) They're...just kind of dull to roleplay with, I guess. People obsess over making big, bad, scary characters instead of real, nicely developed characters.

Maybe it's just the fact that I tend to hide out in mapped roleplays that I find this behavior so annoying? It reminds me of that Spongebob episode where he gets those gigantic fake muscles and can't actually do anything useful with them.
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: Silhouette on November 14, 2013, 03:49:58 pm
Irk. I don't see the point in people constantly trying to win the fights either. How on earth does that do any for you, much less develop your character? Most of the time, when I RP with friends its something to the tune of this,

Antagonist finds a means of wrecking havoc, protagonists try to stop it. Protagonists fail due to either inexperience, lack of strategy, or being caught off guard.
Protagonists move away to  "lick their wounds"
Antagonist returns in another RP randomly without warning (though its anticipated by the players that said antagonist will return at some random point), protagonist or antagonist may reap the benefits but its usually not much and the fight fizzles out
Antagonist makes a final return/Protagonist characters seek out the antagonist with a potential solution and either the protagonist wins or if that doesnt turn out and they lose, they go away to "lick their wounds" again and return again when they have another solution. Sooner or later or though, the proper solution is found and the antagonist is removed from the picture, either he/she is killed, banished, whatever.

Its a nice way of giving players on both sides of the RP some opportunity to be the strong-hold and the wounded and have fun with it. But at the end of the day, does it really matter at all? No not really. My main character has lost as many fights as she's won. There's nothing to gain from it.
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: unnbrellas on November 14, 2013, 09:49:12 pm
Spongebob episode where he gets those gigantic fake muscles and can't actually do anything useful with them.

YES.
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: Silhouette on November 15, 2013, 12:41:02 am
Spongebob episode where he gets those gigantic fake muscles and can't actually do anything useful with them.

YES.

I must have missed this. That is probably the best analogy for this I've ever heard. LOL
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: Vespian on November 15, 2013, 01:20:51 am
The pride of said individuals never cease to amuse me. I too have witnessed such behavior in a large variety of roleplays. Each one ending up with that particular individual screaming the lines of, "My character is 9ever undefeated! None shall defeat me!" Thus, when a member attempts to prove them wrong, it ends up like Lady Alizarin has stated:
And in some roleplay battles, there's always that one character that just seems so undefeatable and pretty much ignores any attacks thrown at him/her. And when you call them a powerplayer for ignoring your attacks, they throw a big fit about it.
What's beyond me however is sometimes, not all, I witness some members attempting at informing the said 'undefeated character' on how not everyone can win all the time. If that were true, it'd not only make your character be perceived as someone unfair and/or boring, it'd cause them to appear as someone under the title of perfection. Which, let's admit it, imperfection is what makes life so meaningful. Yet the said perfected member takes it not only as an IC-insult but an OOC one as well. I know not about you guys, though if someone told me a bit of advice on how to improve my character and/or roleplay style, I'd at least take consideration into their advice. However most of the time when said event happens, the member stirs up an argument and before you know it, hello senseless grudge!

I can comprehend why certain members do this from time to time. It could be because they've grown attached to their current character and fears something fatal happening to it. Which gives them the urge in making their character, how should I say it, god-like. They could also be seeking attention, such as gaining the title of, "The most feared member in all of Feralheart!", "The most strongest wolf in all of the Plains!", etc. The possibilities/reasons can very much vary from member to member.

As for me, I rarely will get involved with conflict unless it's a part of the roleplay plot or my character's general personality. Even then, most of the time I commence as long as the fight involves individuals who I have witnessed roleplay before and know their general skills or if it's a good friend. A majority of the time however, you'll most likely find me holding some binoculars and watching from the sidelines as an innocent bystander.
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: Jango_Fett on November 15, 2013, 06:40:37 pm
Spongebob episode where he gets those gigantic fake muscles and can't actually do anything useful with them.

YES.

I must have missed this. That is probably the best analogy for this I've ever heard. LOL


 Very much so xD! I have nothing more to add.
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: BlackLuna06 on November 16, 2013, 07:14:59 am
-flails noodle arms upon entering thread-

OHYUSH.

*Ahem*

I strongly agree, and have noticed, been irritated by and now want to expand upon this observation.

There are the obvious, irritating and frankly rather stupid things known as 'powerplaying' or 'goddmodding' that get a lot of publicity. Being 'undefeatable' or having 'special powers' when in a semi-real to realistic RP is just a 'lil bit idiotic and makes others judge you very quickly. This, most of us know and dislike.

But there are also the people, who, while they accept your attacks and whatnot, will never concede OOC that they have lost, that their character has lost. While phrases like 'she limped from the connecting blow to the shoulder' are usually thrown in there and the person Rps accordingly, they will still never lose. Ever. They just keep the fight going until the other person decides to have their character beaten due to a tediously long fight.

It doesn't matter, really, as it's about RP who wins or loses, its just fun to see what moves and challenges you can stem from other people.

These 'non-conceders' are, essentially, a really dulled down version of powerplayers and therefore go un-noticed often, as they don't do anything outrageously stupid like 'shoots fire from eyes' (See it happen -_-).

-flops about-

Rant over c:

Snarf, out.
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: gold feathers on November 16, 2013, 04:27:26 pm
I deliberately make my character lose a battle to show her weakness and fragile side. I also make the fight scenes sound realistic and gradual.

It doesn't really matter who wins unless... you are playing as a strong and insidious character, for example a demon or enemy and the opponent is a weakling like a pup or young fox. It would make the fight unrealistic and a bit power played if the weaker one won to a much stronger opponent.

However not all fights have to consist of stronger winning with weaker. The weaker for example might have a hidden power and only find it when in danger, they then use it to defeat the stronger opponent who is confused about such power, and completely unprepared.

So therefore it doesn't matter who wins, it's the content that matters most of all and how realistic you make it. (Don't forget interesting aswell)

~Crystal~
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: Jango_Fett on November 18, 2013, 04:33:06 pm
 I've been doing some thinking, and here is what I came up with.


Losing a battle, you can learn from that and it can add more character to you, but sometimes, failure is not an option, it can lead to death, destruction, and pain.

I see both sides of the equation, so I understand why you think losing a battle won't hurt anyone too badly, and how others may think that failure is NEVER an option, and think you need to win every time.

~Warrior, The Good Ol' SheepDog
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: Feareh on November 18, 2013, 05:37:33 pm
 Ive seen this on some occasion when I used to RP and now adays. I think its the fact that kids don't want there "high skilled character" to lose. Really in ways, people don't want to picture there character as weak.
Personally I find that people who cant be a sport and lose at times to be somewhat of a cross between powerplayer.
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: wolvesaregreat on November 24, 2013, 08:17:38 pm
It is happening because it's hard for us to accept the failure. Many people rely on games to build up some fake self confidence and feel of victory, mostly because they aren't able to achieve it in real life. Since they have chance to prove themselves in some other world where nobody knows their true face, they don't want to fail even in virtual world, so many find it hard to accept that failure. Honestly I also like to win and build up reputation "the one who everyone fears of", but that doesn't mean I want to turn to powerplaying and such. I prefer to act realistic and to get a scar or two. I hope one day we'll have battle system like one of WIP game PrimitiveCall will make. That way everyone will be able to prove their real strength by actually showing it with something more than usual typing.
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: Abomine on November 24, 2013, 08:50:01 pm
This is why I tend to avoid those kinds of characters (and those kinds of roleplays). It just seems so childish, to want to be the biggest, baddest kid on the block. This is a GAME, people! Calm down!

And besides, with everybody making their characters "hardcore" invincible fighters, nobody would ever win in a fight, anyway. It's like,

"You can't beat me! I'm the lead alpha wolf in my pack! I've killed an entire herd of bison, all on my own! I've never lost a fight!"
"You can't beat me, either! I'm the strongest warrior in my clan! I've killed an entire pack of wild dogs, all by myself! I've never lost a fight, either!"
"Well, you still can't beat me!
"And you can't beat me!"
"Grrrrrr!"
"Grrrrr!"

What's the point of something like this? It just makes for boring characters and boring rps. It's like how everybody likes to make their characters "big" in Character Creator, so when I play as one of my "big" characters and go into a public map, everybody's on their "big" characters, so my character just ends up looking normal-sized (and the few normal-sized characters look like munchkins).
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: wolvesaregreat on November 24, 2013, 09:29:08 pm
This is why I tend to avoid those kinds of characters (and those kinds of roleplays). It just seems so childish, to want to be the biggest, baddest kid on the block. This is a GAME, people! Calm down!

And besides, with everybody making their characters "hardcore" invincible fighters, nobody would ever win in a fight, anyway. It's like,

"You can't beat me! I'm the lead alpha wolf in my pack! I've killed an entire herd of bison, all on my own! I've never lost a fight!"
"You can't beat me, either! I'm the strongest warrior in my clan! I've killed an entire pack of wild dogs, all by myself! I've never lost a fight, either!"
"Well, you still can't beat me!
"And you can't beat me!"
"Grrrrrr!"
"Grrrrr!"

What's the point of something like this? It just makes for boring characters and boring rps. It's like how everybody likes to make their characters "big" in Character Creator, so when I play as one of my "big" characters and go into a public map, everybody's on their "big" characters, so my character just ends up looking normal-sized (and the few normal-sized characters look like munchkins).
*reply to quotes* POWERPLAY ALERT! >:O Don't you just hate that? Bison herd? Seriously?
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: ~Stargazer~ on November 26, 2013, 01:02:56 pm
Spongebob episode where he gets those gigantic fake muscles and can't actually do anything useful with them.


OMG, that's priceless XD I remember that episode LOL

But seriously, it's better to have a humble character that isn't great at everything than one who cheats to win battles.
Title: Re: Is Always Winning Really That Important?
Post by: Black-Serpent on December 02, 2013, 04:56:52 pm
It's a common thing to wanting to be the perfect fighter and win every battle. Yes, we can look at the scenario in a fantasy point of view, however, even in fantasy, there is imperfection. Not everyone wins, the "hero" doesn't always get the last laugh. If they did, would they be interesting in a whole?

With a character that is spot on with everything, in this case, winning, how are they interesting? What does it say about the character themselves? Yes, we could agree they are strong, but is that it? Winning does not define the character, interaction and progression does. In my opinion, if there is no loses, how can your character grow? In developing a character, it is great to see how they learn and improve themselves in whatever story-line they are put into.


 It's of nature for one that wishes to express dominance and ferocity in a game that possess
the ability to battle. When one approaches another that peeks to challenge, it is there to see who shall
come on top. The two that possess great tenacity and pompous pseudo-achievements and that appear
as one of the 'best' fighters in the game, it is again of nature for one to challenge. Looking at historical figures, specifically in Greece,
you can see Gladiators battle to the death for example. Would one like to lose to a
crowd, and to lose their character? Absolutely not. Unless furtherance with planning would depict a clear
plot on who the victor would be, it is necessary that one in peril would respectively be defeated as in
accordance to the plot.

For my experience and my value of fighting in role-play (as well as in reality), I would not like to lose to
any fight at all. Losing a fight leaves guilt, shame, and embarrassment. These emotions described in reality
integrate with Feralheart as many are already aware that emotions on here can be noticed if one is taken
seriously. Most role-play battles on FeralHeart are took very seriously, and that answers what I described as above.

Though yes, winning is an important factor when it comes down to fighting, and it does
progress your character, define what character it is, and what sort of interaction it may have on others as long as the
player acknowledges the character as a whole and the talents it has.